From hgfernan lsi.usp.br Mon Sep 13 19:12:48 2004 From: hgfernan lsi.usp.br (Hilton Garcia Fernandes) Date: Wed Sep 15 08:19:54 2004 Subject: [MPEGIF Discuss] Is it possible to create a free software, or open source or public domain implementation of AVC ? Message-ID: <200409131812.48746.hgfernan@lsi.usp.br> Dear all, Since i'm no lawyer and not even familiar with intelectual property questions, i ask you to please answer me the long question in the Subject: Is it possible to create a free software, or open source or public domain implementation of AVC ? I mean is it true that due to patent/licensing, every non commercial implementation of AVC is precluded ? I look forward -- Hilton Garcia Fernandes N?cleo de Tecnologias sem Fio (Wireless Technologies Team) LSI - Escola Polit?cnica - USP tel.: (11)3091-5589 cel.: (11)8131-5213 Av. Prof. Luciano Gualberto, 158 trav. 3 CEP 05508-900 -- S. Paulo -- SP -- Brazil Home Page: http://www.lsi.usp.br/~hgfernan From igino.manfre tiscali.it Tue Sep 28 20:26:20 2004 From: igino.manfre tiscali.it (igino manfre') Date: Wed Sep 29 09:11:52 2004 Subject: [MPEGIF Discuss] [systems] [discussion] Who framed MPEG-4 within H264 ? Message-ID: Hi people, It seems me that we are forgetting that MPEG-4 is NOT ONLY a visual compression scheme. Really it is all but BUT NOT ONLY a visual compression scheme. I presume you all agree. If we consider the subjects of this newsgroup, in the last two-three years the focus migrates from the visual (who was in or out MPEG-4) to the MPEG-LA licensing schemes (that could better defined "mpeg-4 suicide") and again back to the visual (h264). It can be also felt a growing interest from India and far east. In this landscape, I find almost no mail related to the "system" of MPEG-4, and I do not think because they are better explained. Two years ago there had been a lot of development of SDKs and authoring systems in the area, many of which used to work (even fine). Probably all these have been commercial flops since now at the exhibitions no-one is more pushing fully MPEG-4 based solutions. All and only H264. Does it means that MPEG-4 (in its complex) is dead ? Really, for what I know, excluding the many experiments and demo targeted to demostrate the power of object encoding and multiplexing within MPEG-4 systems (meanly two-three years old), I do not know any "true" (i.e. marketable) application of "true" MPEG-4 after the part "-2". Today the entire world is fashioned by H264. Its astonishing 2-3 Mbps 720P video will probably be the first "true" MPEG-4 part really diffused on the Earth. All the broadcast encoder manufacturer are today able to show their h264 solution... But the broadcast usage will probably be a terrible mix of H264 ES video & MP3 or AC3 audio over MPEG-2 transport. The goal is to "squeeze" enough the required bandwidth to allow the deploiment of high definition TV over cable modem. To make this mix dirtier, probably these broadcast will carry OCAP or MHP/OpenTV interactivity. Does not it sound a little blasfeme ? What do you think about ? The diffusion of MPEG-2 STB is not a key factor, since the current STBs must be replaced in any case to decompress the H264. But a STB that will be able to decode H264 could have enough computational power to implement the entire standard. Really it is an architectural problem since if the entire decoder will be put in a dice of silicon any further expansion could not be possible... An observation I expect is that as "the market trains the research", as well it trains the newsgroups. But maybe the locomotives (or who designs the railways) do not sufficiently know what COULD be available... Are we really sure to have done the right work ? Best regards, Igino Manfre' ----------------------- Igino Manfre' - igino.manfre@tiscali.it Broadcast Video Consultant Mobile (+39) 3358235346 Home (+39) 0650916416 13, Largo Nearco I 00124 ROMA - ITALY From young netntv.co.kr Thu Sep 30 02:31:26 2004 From: young netntv.co.kr (LIM, Young-Kwon) Date: Thu Sep 30 13:40:08 2004 Subject: [MPEGIF Discuss] [systems] [discussion] Who framed MPEG-4 withinH264 ? References: Message-ID: <016c01c4a641$c59974b0$aa00a8c0@young> Dear Igino Manfre I just want to inform you that there is a service planning to use MPEG-4 Systems for broadcasting interactive contents. Korea is introducing new broadcasting service for mobile reception early next year which is adopting MPEG-4 BIFS for the interactive contents. It will be the world first commercial broadcasting service based on MPEG-4 Systems. Sincerely, Young-Kwon LIM VP Business Development net&tv Inc. ----- Original Message ----- From: "igino manfre'" To: ; Sent: Wednesday, September 29, 2023 2:26 AM Subject: [MPEGIF Discuss] [systems] [discussion] Who framed MPEG-4 withinH264 ? > Hi people, > > It seems me that we are forgetting that MPEG-4 is NOT ONLY a visual > compression scheme. > Really it is all but BUT NOT ONLY a visual compression scheme. > > I presume you all agree. > > If we consider the subjects of this newsgroup, in the last two-three years > the focus migrates from the visual (who was in or out MPEG-4) to the MPEG-LA > licensing schemes (that could better defined "mpeg-4 suicide") and again > back to the visual (h264). It can be also felt a growing interest from India > and far east. > > In this landscape, I find almost no mail related to the "system" of MPEG-4, > and I do not think because they are better explained. > > Two years ago there had been a lot of development of SDKs and authoring > systems in the area, many of which used to work (even fine). Probably all > these have been commercial flops since now at the exhibitions no-one is more > pushing fully MPEG-4 based solutions. All and only H264. Does it means that > MPEG-4 (in its complex) is dead ? > > Really, for what I know, excluding the many experiments and demo targeted to > demostrate the power of object encoding and multiplexing within MPEG-4 > systems (meanly two-three years old), I do not know any "true" (i.e. > marketable) application of "true" MPEG-4 after the part "-2". > > Today the entire world is fashioned by H264. Its astonishing 2-3 Mbps 720P > video will probably be the first "true" MPEG-4 part really diffused on the > Earth. All the broadcast encoder manufacturer are today able to show their > h264 solution... > > But the broadcast usage will probably be a terrible mix of H264 ES video & > MP3 or AC3 audio over MPEG-2 transport. The goal is to "squeeze" enough the > required bandwidth to allow the deploiment of high definition TV over cable > modem. To make this mix dirtier, probably these broadcast will carry OCAP or > MHP/OpenTV interactivity. > > Does not it sound a little blasfeme ? What do you think about ? > > The diffusion of MPEG-2 STB is not a key factor, since the current STBs must > be replaced in any case to decompress the H264. But a STB that will be able > to decode H264 could have enough computational power to implement the entire > standard. > > Really it is an architectural problem since if the entire decoder will be > put in a dice of silicon any further expansion could not be possible... > > An observation I expect is that as "the market trains the research", as well > it trains the newsgroups. But maybe the locomotives (or who designs the > railways) do not sufficiently know what COULD be available... > > Are we really sure to have done the right work ? > > Best regards, Igino Manfre' > > ----------------------- > > Igino Manfre' - igino.manfre@tiscali.it > Broadcast Video Consultant > Mobile (+39) 3358235346 > Home (+39) 0650916416 > 13, Largo Nearco > I 00124 ROMA - ITALY > > _______________________________________________ > Discuss mailing list > Discuss@lists.mpegif.org > http://lists.mpegif.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss > > Note: Conduct on the mailing list is subject to the Antitrust guidelines found at http://www.mpegif.org/public/documents/vault/mp-out-30042-Antitrust.php > From c.fombonne ateme.fr Wed Sep 29 19:57:34 2004 From: c.fombonne ateme.fr (Cyril Fombonne) Date: Thu Sep 30 13:42:08 2004 Subject: [MPEGIF Discuss] [systems] [discussion] Who framed MPEG-4 withinH264 ? References: Message-ID: <0a4801c4a645$6ac5d200$c41010ac@pc196> Hello Igino, This would be true if Nero Digital(tm) did not exist. Nero Digital(tm) is the brand name that encompasses MPEG-4 Audio, MPEG-4 Video and MPEG-4 System parts of the ISO 14496. Regarding the specs, this is really a global MPEG-4 implementation with some more extended features. That means that it brings all flavours of crispy AAC (LC, HE) sound with all system features such as MP4 file with chapter marks, multiple subtitles, multiple audio tracks. Now moving to technology. All the above mentionned features are existing now and IC manufacturers already start to embedd the technology. Ateme, co-developper of Nero Digital with Ahead Software, has it all for you to deploy devices, including full documentation and licensing schemes. Now try the first tool featuring Nero Digital(tm) : Nero Recode 2 (encode any content to Nero Digital file). This is the best performing tool to date on the encoding side. Speed benchmarks confirm this, at equal quality / set of parameters. The easiness is also emphasised. And above all, Nero Digital relies on a very large community of users creating content every day, and potentially creating a pull for embedded STBs / players. I hope you got the message and that everyone will keep pushing MPEG-4 Video but also Audio and System as it proves himself to be simply the best technology for quality at lowest bitrates. Cyril Fombonne Product Manager Tel: +33 1 69 35 89 88 Fax: +33 1 60 19 13 95 www.ateme.com Nero Digital - Watch. Listen. Experience. www.nerodigital.com ----- Original Message ----- From: igino manfre' To: mp4-tech@lists.mpegif.org ; discuss@lists.mpegif.org Sent: Tuesday, September 28, 2023 7:26 PM Subject: [MPEGIF Discuss] [systems] [discussion] Who framed MPEG-4 withinH264 ? Hi people, It seems me that we are forgetting that MPEG-4 is NOT ONLY a visual compression scheme. Really it is all but BUT NOT ONLY a visual compression scheme. I presume you all agree. If we consider the subjects of this newsgroup, in the last two-three years the focus migrates from the visual (who was in or out MPEG-4) to the MPEG-LA licensing schemes (that could better defined "mpeg-4 suicide") and again back to the visual (h264). It can be also felt a growing interest from India and far east. In this landscape, I find almost no mail related to the "system" of MPEG-4, and I do not think because they are better explained. Two years ago there had been a lot of development of SDKs and authoring systems in the area, many of which used to work (even fine). Probably all these have been commercial flops since now at the exhibitions no-one is more pushing fully MPEG-4 based solutions. All and only H264. Does it means that MPEG-4 (in its complex) is dead ? Really, for what I know, excluding the many experiments and demo targeted to demostrate the power of object encoding and multiplexing within MPEG-4 systems (meanly two-three years old), I do not know any "true" (i.e. marketable) application of "true" MPEG-4 after the part "-2". Today the entire world is fashioned by H264. Its astonishing 2-3 Mbps 720P video will probably be the first "true" MPEG-4 part really diffused on the Earth. All the broadcast encoder manufacturer are today able to show their h264 solution... But the broadcast usage will probably be a terrible mix of H264 ES video & MP3 or AC3 audio over MPEG-2 transport. The goal is to "squeeze" enough the required bandwidth to allow the deploiment of high definition TV over cable modem. To make this mix dirtier, probably these broadcast will carry OCAP or MHP/OpenTV interactivity. Does not it sound a little blasfeme ? What do you think about ? The diffusion of MPEG-2 STB is not a key factor, since the current STBs must be replaced in any case to decompress the H264. But a STB that will be able to decode H264 could have enough computational power to implement the entire standard. Really it is an architectural problem since if the entire decoder will be put in a dice of silicon any further expansion could not be possible... An observation I expect is that as "the market trains the research", as well it trains the newsgroups. But maybe the locomotives (or who designs the railways) do not sufficiently know what COULD be available... Are we really sure to have done the right work ? Best regards, Igino Manfre' ----------------------- Igino Manfre' - igino.manfre@tiscali.it Broadcast Video Consultant Mobile (+39) 3358235346 Home (+39) 0650916416 13, Largo Nearco I 00124 ROMA - ITALY _______________________________________________ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.mpegif.org http://lists.mpegif.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss Note: Conduct on the mailing list is subject to the Antitrust guidelines found at http://www.mpegif.org/public/documents/vault/mp-out-30042-Antitrust.php -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: /pipermail/discuss/attachments/20040929/6e586e38/attachment.html From igino.manfre tiscali.it Wed Sep 29 20:14:14 2004 From: igino.manfre tiscali.it (igino manfre') Date: Thu Sep 30 13:44:25 2004 Subject: [MPEGIF Discuss] [systems] First Usage MPEG-4 system in Korea ! In-Reply-To: <016c01c4a641$c59974b0$aa00a8c0@young> Message-ID: Dear Mr Young-Kwon, It is very interesting to know what you wrote in your answer. I read that your target is mobile telephony (or maybe PDA wireless). Do you investigate the feasibility of extending your application to other physical layers (such as video over DSL or DTT) I try to understand it from your web site, but I do not speak or read korean. Thank you again, Igino MANFRE' ----------------------- Igino Manfre' - igino.manfre@tiscali.it Broadcast Video Consultant Mobile (+39) 3358235346 Home (+39) 0650916416 13, Largo Nearco I 00124 ROMA - ITALY -----Messaggio originale----- Da: LIM, Young-Kwon [mailto:young@netntv.co.kr] Inviato: mercoled? 29 settembre 2004 18:31 A: igino manfre'; mp4-tech@lists.mpegif.org; discuss@lists.mpegif.org Oggetto: Re: [MPEGIF Discuss] [systems] [discussion] Who framed MPEG-4 withinH264 ? Dear Igino Manfre I just want to inform you that there is a service planning to use MPEG-4 Systems for broadcasting interactive contents. Korea is introducing new broadcasting service for mobile reception early next year which is adopting MPEG-4 BIFS for the interactive contents. It will be the world first commercial broadcasting service based on MPEG-4 Systems. Sincerely, Young-Kwon LIM VP Business Development net&tv Inc. ----- Original Message ----- From: "igino manfre'" To: ; Sent: Wednesday, September 29, 2023 2:26 AM Subject: [MPEGIF Discuss] [systems] [discussion] Who framed MPEG-4 withinH264 ? > Hi people, > > It seems me that we are forgetting that MPEG-4 is NOT ONLY a visual > compression scheme. > Really it is all but BUT NOT ONLY a visual compression scheme. > > I presume you all agree. > > If we consider the subjects of this newsgroup, in the last two-three years > the focus migrates from the visual (who was in or out MPEG-4) to the MPEG-LA > licensing schemes (that could better defined "mpeg-4 suicide") and again > back to the visual (h264). It can be also felt a growing interest from India > and far east. > > In this landscape, I find almost no mail related to the "system" of MPEG-4, > and I do not think because they are better explained. > > Two years ago there had been a lot of development of SDKs and authoring > systems in the area, many of which used to work (even fine). Probably all > these have been commercial flops since now at the exhibitions no-one is more > pushing fully MPEG-4 based solutions. All and only H264. Does it means that > MPEG-4 (in its complex) is dead ? > > Really, for what I know, excluding the many experiments and demo targeted to > demostrate the power of object encoding and multiplexing within MPEG-4 > systems (meanly two-three years old), I do not know any "true" (i.e. > marketable) application of "true" MPEG-4 after the part "-2". > > Today the entire world is fashioned by H264. Its astonishing 2-3 Mbps 720P > video will probably be the first "true" MPEG-4 part really diffused on the > Earth. All the broadcast encoder manufacturer are today able to show their > h264 solution... > > But the broadcast usage will probably be a terrible mix of H264 ES video & > MP3 or AC3 audio over MPEG-2 transport. The goal is to "squeeze" enough the > required bandwidth to allow the deploiment of high definition TV over cable > modem. To make this mix dirtier, probably these broadcast will carry OCAP or > MHP/OpenTV interactivity. > > Does not it sound a little blasfeme ? What do you think about ? > > The diffusion of MPEG-2 STB is not a key factor, since the current STBs must > be replaced in any case to decompress the H264. But a STB that will be able > to decode H264 could have enough computational power to implement the entire > standard. > > Really it is an architectural problem since if the entire decoder will be > put in a dice of silicon any further expansion could not be possible... > > An observation I expect is that as "the market trains the research", as well > it trains the newsgroups. But maybe the locomotives (or who designs the > railways) do not sufficiently know what COULD be available... > > Are we really sure to have done the right work ? > > Best regards, Igino Manfre' > > ----------------------- > > Igino Manfre' - igino.manfre@tiscali.it > Broadcast Video Consultant > Mobile (+39) 3358235346 > Home (+39) 0650916416 > 13, Largo Nearco > I 00124 ROMA - ITALY > > _______________________________________________ > Discuss mailing list > Discuss@lists.mpegif.org > http://lists.mpegif.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss > > Note: Conduct on the mailing list is subject to the Antitrust guidelines found at http://www.mpegif.org/public/documents/vault/mp-out-30042-Antitrust.php > From igino.manfre tiscali.it Wed Sep 29 20:24:16 2004 From: igino.manfre tiscali.it (igino manfre') Date: Thu Sep 30 13:46:45 2004 Subject: [MPEGIF Discuss] [systems] does exist MPEG-4 system application for TV over DSL ? In-Reply-To: <0a4801c4a645$6ac5d200$c41010ac@pc196> Message-ID: Dear Cyril, I had the pleasure to see Nero Digital at Ateme boot last IBC, and I browse the web looking for the characteristics of the product. You have the power of Nero to deploy your application. In the meantime DTT is going to be implemented everywhere in the "old" MPEG-2 ... I had the broadcast TV in mind writing about "framing" of MPEG-4. I thought to immense possibilities of ISO 14996 could show if adopted for consumer television over DSL network or -- generally speaking -- through ibrid networks where an access gateway merge all the possible streams toward the user. There, I think, MPEG-4 systems could deploy its power, but any application is extremely good to now!. In any case, thank you again, Igino Manfre' ----------------------- Igino Manfre' - igino.manfre@tiscali.it Broadcast Video Consultant Mobile (+39) 3358235346 Home (+39) 0650916416 13, Largo Nearco I 00124 ROMA - ITALY -----Messaggio originale----- Da: Cyril Fombonne [mailto:c.fombonne@ateme.fr] Inviato: mercoled? 29 settembre 2004 18:58 A: igino manfre' Cc: mp4-tech@lists.mpegif.org; discuss@lists.mpegif.org Oggetto: Re: [MPEGIF Discuss] [systems] [discussion] Who framed MPEG-4 withinH264 ? Hello Igino, This would be true if Nero Digital(tm) did not exist. Nero Digital(tm) is the brand name that encompasses MPEG-4 Audio, MPEG-4 Video and MPEG-4 System parts of the ISO 14496. Regarding the specs, this is really a global MPEG-4 implementation with some more extended features. That means that it brings all flavours of crispy AAC (LC, HE) sound with all system features such as MP4 file with chapter marks, multiple subtitles, multiple audio tracks. Now moving to technology. All the above mentionned features are existing now and IC manufacturers already start to embedd the technology. Ateme, co-developper of Nero Digital with Ahead Software, has it all for you to deploy devices, including full documentation and licensing schemes. Now try the first tool featuring Nero Digital(tm) : Nero Recode 2 (encode any content to Nero Digital file). This is the best performing tool to date on the encoding side. Speed benchmarks confirm this, at equal quality / set of parameters. The easiness is also emphasised. And above all, Nero Digital relies on a very large community of users creating content every day, and potentially creating a pull for embedded STBs / players. I hope you got the message and that everyone will keep pushing MPEG-4 Video but also Audio and System as it proves himself to be simply the best technology for quality at lowest bitrates. Cyril Fombonne Product Manager Tel: +33 1 69 35 89 88 Fax: +33 1 60 19 13 95 www.ateme.com Nero Digital - Watch. Listen. Experience. www.nerodigital.com ----- Original Message ----- From: igino manfre' To: mp4-tech@lists.mpegif.org ; discuss@lists.mpegif.org Sent: Tuesday, September 28, 2023 7:26 PM Subject: [MPEGIF Discuss] [systems] [discussion] Who framed MPEG-4 withinH264 ? Hi people, It seems me that we are forgetting that MPEG-4 is NOT ONLY a visual compression scheme. Really it is all but BUT NOT ONLY a visual compression scheme. I presume you all agree. If we consider the subjects of this newsgroup, in the last two-three years the focus migrates from the visual (who was in or out MPEG-4) to the MPEG-LA licensing schemes (that could better defined "mpeg-4 suicide") and again back to the visual (h264). It can be also felt a growing interest from India and far east. In this landscape, I find almost no mail related to the "system" of MPEG-4, and I do not think because they are better explained. Two years ago there had been a lot of development of SDKs and authoring systems in the area, many of which used to work (even fine). Probably all these have been commercial flops since now at the exhibitions no-one is more pushing fully MPEG-4 based solutions. All and only H264. Does it means that MPEG-4 (in its complex) is dead ? Really, for what I know, excluding the many experiments and demo targeted to demostrate the power of object encoding and multiplexing within MPEG-4 systems (meanly two-three years old), I do not know any "true" (i.e. marketable) application of "true" MPEG-4 after the part "-2". Today the entire world is fashioned by H264. Its astonishing 2-3 Mbps 720P video will probably be the first "true" MPEG-4 part really diffused on the Earth. All the broadcast encoder manufacturer are today able to show their h264 solution... But the broadcast usage will probably be a terrible mix of H264 ES video & MP3 or AC3 audio over MPEG-2 transport. The goal is to "squeeze" enough the required bandwidth to allow the deploiment of high definition TV over cable modem. To make this mix dirtier, probably these broadcast will carry OCAP or MHP/OpenTV interactivity. Does not it sound a little blasfeme ? What do you think about ? The diffusion of MPEG-2 STB is not a key factor, since the current STBs must be replaced in any case to decompress the H264. But a STB that will be able to decode H264 could have enough computational power to implement the entire standard. Really it is an architectural problem since if the entire decoder will be put in a dice of silicon any further expansion could not be possible... An observation I expect is that as "the market trains the research", as well it trains the newsgroups. But maybe the locomotives (or who designs the railways) do not sufficiently know what COULD be available... Are we really sure to have done the right work ? Best regards, Igino Manfre' ----------------------- Igino Manfre' - igino.manfre@tiscali.it Broadcast Video Consultant Mobile (+39) 3358235346 Home (+39) 0650916416 13, Largo Nearco I 00124 ROMA - ITALY _______________________________________________ Discuss mailing list Discuss@lists.mpegif.org http://lists.mpegif.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss Note: Conduct on the mailing list is subject to the Antitrust guidelines found at http://www.mpegif.org/public/documents/vault/mp-out-30042-Antitrust.php -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: /pipermail/discuss/attachments/20040929/d6db7339/attachment-0001.html From young netntv.co.kr Thu Sep 30 03:42:48 2004 From: young netntv.co.kr (LIM, Young-Kwon) Date: Thu Sep 30 13:49:00 2004 Subject: [MPEGIF Discuss] [systems] First Usage MPEG-4 system in Korea ! References: Message-ID: <01cc01c4a64c$f4796be0$aa00a8c0@young> Dear Igino, Our target is not limited to mobile telephony. It is targetting mobile television. Our system is truly indepent on physical layers. I know that there were several trial to use MPEG-4 Systems over cable networks in USA by envivio or iVast. Young. ----- Original Message ----- From: "igino manfre'" To: "LIM, Young-Kwon" ; ; Sent: Thursday, September 30, 2023 2:14 AM Subject: [MPEGIF Discuss] [systems] First Usage MPEG-4 system in Korea ! > Dear Mr Young-Kwon, > > It is very interesting to know what you wrote in your answer. > I read that your target is mobile telephony (or maybe PDA wireless). > Do you investigate the feasibility of extending your application to other > physical layers (such as video over DSL or DTT) > I try to understand it from your web site, but I do not speak or read > korean. > > Thank you again, > Igino MANFRE' > > ----------------------- > > Igino Manfre' - igino.manfre@tiscali.it > Broadcast Video Consultant > Mobile (+39) 3358235346 > Home (+39) 0650916416 > 13, Largo Nearco > I 00124 ROMA - ITALY > > -----Messaggio originale----- > Da: LIM, Young-Kwon [mailto:young@netntv.co.kr] > Inviato: mercoled? 29 settembre 2004 18:31 > A: igino manfre'; mp4-tech@lists.mpegif.org; discuss@lists.mpegif.org > Oggetto: Re: [MPEGIF Discuss] [systems] [discussion] Who framed MPEG-4 > withinH264 ? > > > Dear Igino Manfre > > I just want to inform you that there is a service planning to use MPEG-4 > Systems for broadcasting interactive contents. Korea is introducing new > broadcasting service for mobile reception early next year which is adopting > MPEG-4 BIFS for the interactive contents. It will be the world first > commercial broadcasting service based on MPEG-4 Systems. > > Sincerely, > Young-Kwon LIM > VP Business Development > net&tv Inc. > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "igino manfre'" > To: ; > Sent: Wednesday, September 29, 2023 2:26 AM > Subject: [MPEGIF Discuss] [systems] [discussion] Who framed MPEG-4 > withinH264 ? > > >> Hi people, >> >> It seems me that we are forgetting that MPEG-4 is NOT ONLY a visual >> compression scheme. >> Really it is all but BUT NOT ONLY a visual compression scheme. >> >> I presume you all agree. >> >> If we consider the subjects of this newsgroup, in the last two-three years >> the focus migrates from the visual (who was in or out MPEG-4) to the > MPEG-LA >> licensing schemes (that could better defined "mpeg-4 suicide") and again >> back to the visual (h264). It can be also felt a growing interest from > India >> and far east. >> >> In this landscape, I find almost no mail related to the "system" of > MPEG-4, >> and I do not think because they are better explained. >> >> Two years ago there had been a lot of development of SDKs and authoring >> systems in the area, many of which used to work (even fine). Probably all >> these have been commercial flops since now at the exhibitions no-one is > more >> pushing fully MPEG-4 based solutions. All and only H264. Does it means > that >> MPEG-4 (in its complex) is dead ? >> >> Really, for what I know, excluding the many experiments and demo targeted > to >> demostrate the power of object encoding and multiplexing within MPEG-4 >> systems (meanly two-three years old), I do not know any "true" (i.e. >> marketable) application of "true" MPEG-4 after the part "-2". >> >> Today the entire world is fashioned by H264. Its astonishing 2-3 Mbps 720P >> video will probably be the first "true" MPEG-4 part really diffused on the >> Earth. All the broadcast encoder manufacturer are today able to show their >> h264 solution... >> >> But the broadcast usage will probably be a terrible mix of H264 ES video & >> MP3 or AC3 audio over MPEG-2 transport. The goal is to "squeeze" enough > the >> required bandwidth to allow the deploiment of high definition TV over > cable >> modem. To make this mix dirtier, probably these broadcast will carry OCAP > or >> MHP/OpenTV interactivity. >> >> Does not it sound a little blasfeme ? What do you think about ? >> >> The diffusion of MPEG-2 STB is not a key factor, since the current STBs > must >> be replaced in any case to decompress the H264. But a STB that will be > able >> to decode H264 could have enough computational power to implement the > entire >> standard. >> >> Really it is an architectural problem since if the entire decoder will be >> put in a dice of silicon any further expansion could not be possible... >> >> An observation I expect is that as "the market trains the research", as > well >> it trains the newsgroups. But maybe the locomotives (or who designs the >> railways) do not sufficiently know what COULD be available... >> >> Are we really sure to have done the right work ? >> >> Best regards, Igino Manfre' >> >> ----------------------- >> >> Igino Manfre' - igino.manfre@tiscali.it >> Broadcast Video Consultant >> Mobile (+39) 3358235346 >> Home (+39) 0650916416 >> 13, Largo Nearco >> I 00124 ROMA - ITALY >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Discuss mailing list >> Discuss@lists.mpegif.org >> http://lists.mpegif.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss >> >> Note: Conduct on the mailing list is subject to the Antitrust guidelines > found at > http://www.mpegif.org/public/documents/vault/mp-out-30042-Antitrust.php >> > >