From christian.weigel epost.de Mon Dec 2 17:30:00 2002 From: christian.weigel epost.de (Christian Weigel) Date: Wed Jul 30 14:09:19 2003 Subject: [M4IF Technotes] InputSensor Message-ID: <000401c29a20$0fcd29d0$0500a8c0@christianpc> Hi All! Did someone tried or managed it to create a scene using an InputSensor (e.g. a KeySensor or MouseSensor)? I would be interested in the Syntax (in textual description) of the ineraction elementary stream. Does anyone know if the envivoTV plugin is able to play such scene? Any hints are welcome. Regards Christian Weigel From Cyril.Concolato enst.fr Mon Dec 2 19:19:48 2002 From: Cyril.Concolato enst.fr (Cyril Concolato) Date: Wed Jul 30 14:09:20 2003 Subject: [M4IF Technotes] InputSensor References: <000401c29a20$0fcd29d0$0500a8c0@christianpc> Message-ID: <3DEBA444.7D2A64D4@enst.fr> Hi Christian, > Did someone tried or managed it to create a scene using an InputSensor > (e.g. a KeySensor or MouseSensor)? Yes, we did. > I would be interested in the Syntax (in textual description) of the ineraction > elementary stream. You do not need to specify the syntax of the interaction stream. But you need to specify which kind of device you will use in conjunction with the InputSensor node. There are currently three types of devices defined in MPEG: a KeySensor device, a StringSensor device and a Mouse device. Theses devices produce some data that the BIFS decoder will interpret and forward to the scene so that your scene changes. To have some interaction with the scene, you need to do two things: * First specify the type of device that you will use. You do it by setting the right device name in the DecoderConfigDescriptor that describes the device stream. * Second, specify in the scene what you want to do with the device data. This is done through an InputSensor node linked to that device stream. As usua, the device stream is represented by an ObjectDescriptor. This latter is referenced in the url field of the InputSensor node. Then the buffer of the node contains as many commands as there are units of data in the device data. For instance, a mouse will produce X, Y and a boolean. So there are 3 units of data, hence three replace commands in the InputSensor. These replace commands mean: replace some value in the scene with X, replace some other with Y and finally some other again with the boolean. > Does anyone know if the envivoTV plugin is able to play such scene? Not that I know of. But I do know they are willing to. > Any hints are welcome. Here is a BT file. Hope it helps, Cyril -- Ecole Nationale Sup?rieure des T?l?communications, Paris Dept. Comelec 46, rue Barrault 75013 Paris Tel: +33145817991 Fax: +33145804036 -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: StringSensor.bt Type: application/x-unknown-content-type-ultraedit.bt Size: 6131 bytes Desc: not available Url : /pipermail/mp4-tech/attachments/20021202/c938d5ca/StringSensor.bin From andrea.volpini interact.it Mon Dec 2 18:52:26 2002 From: andrea.volpini interact.it (Andrea Volpini) Date: Wed Jul 30 14:09:20 2003 Subject: [M4IF Technotes] [M4IF Technotes] Message-ID: <7D6B7CE314DF7749AC1DAF89DC0C8BCFAEEA7B@exchange.interact.it> Hello everyone, I'm looking for a tool to check MP4 files in terms of profile and level used for visual and audio. What do you suggest? Andrea Volpini _______ | _| mailto:andrea@interact.it | |_| http://www.interact.it/ | | | Tel: +39 06 58318301 - Fax: +39 06 58318303 |_____|_| Interact - Via A.Bargoni, 78 - 00153 Roma -----Original Message----- From: Christian Weigel [mailto:christian.weigel@epost.de] Sent: Monday, December 02, 2023 5:30 PM To: Technotes@lists.m4if.org Subject: [M4IF Technotes] InputSensor Hi All! Did someone tried or managed it to create a scene using an InputSensor (e.g. a KeySensor or MouseSensor)? I would be interested in the Syntax (in textual description) of the ineraction elementary stream. Does anyone know if the envivoTV plugin is able to play such scene? Any hints are welcome. Regards Christian Weigel _______________________________________________ Technotes mailing list Technotes@lists.m4if.org http://lists.m4if.org/mailman/listinfo/technotes From rob.koenen m4if.org Mon Dec 2 17:17:43 2002 From: rob.koenen m4if.org (Rob Koenen) Date: Wed Jul 30 14:09:20 2003 Subject: [M4IF Technotes] Mp4 file's quality measurement. (fwd) In-Reply-To: <00e801c296c8$0d194260$f340fea9@beck> Message-ID: <3C124172E7FDD511B510000347426D59016BEA8B@exchange.epr.com> > measurement", but I don't know if they can manage MPEG-4 Visual : In theory, such tool model the human visual system and are therefore agnostic to the coding system used. In practice, all these systems have been tried, tested and optimized with - and thus to some extent tuned to - existing coding schemes. Rob ps: Disclaimers about where to successfully use such tools still apply. > -----Original Message----- > From: Olivier Amato [mailto:oamato@wanadoo.fr] > Sent: Thursday, November 28, 2023 2:22 > To: Alisson Vasconcelos de Brito / Pos. COPIN > Cc: technotes@lists.m4if.org > Subject: Re: [M4IF Technotes] Mp4 file's quality measurement. (fwd) > > > > I'd like to know if anybody knows any tool that can be used > measure an > > mpeg-4 video file quality (PSNR, for example). I have to compare a > > modified MPEG-4 file with its original. I am working in my master > > course and it's extremely important to me. > > Some companies claim to provide "objective video quality > measurement", but I don't know if they can manage MPEG-4 Visual : > - Sarnoff's JNDMetrix ( http://www.jndmetrix.com/ ). > - Genista's Video PQoS (> http://www.genista.co.jp/Products/VideoSolutions.htm ). > > > Regards, > > Olivier > > > > _______________________________________________ > Technotes mailing list > Technotes@lists.m4if.org > http://lists.m4if.org/mailman/listinfo/technot> es > From vharisha ftdpl.com Tue Dec 3 09:23:36 2002 From: vharisha ftdpl.com (harisha) Date: Wed Jul 30 14:09:20 2003 Subject: [M4IF Technotes] help Message-ID: <000001c29a7f$8e9c7ea0$92c809c0@system64> Hi We recently purchased ISO reference software for MPEG -4,14496.and I am working with audio part.But the Ref.code is unable decode the bitstream supplied by ISO It fails in MP4Audio_LookForSuitableTracks() in MP4ifc.c File The function call err=MP4GetTrackEnabled(baseTrack,&enabled) always returns enabled=0 After this program terminates.Will You Please tell me the Solutions to above Problem. Thanks. With regards Harisha -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: /pipermail/mp4-tech/attachments/20021203/31e2b465/attachment.html From christian.weigel epost.de Tue Dec 3 13:01:13 2002 From: christian.weigel epost.de (Christian Weigel) Date: Wed Jul 30 14:09:20 2003 Subject: [M4IF Technotes] InputSensor In-Reply-To: <3DEBA444.7D2A64D4@enst.fr> Message-ID: <000401c29ac3$b1d56e10$0500a8c0@christianpc> Cyril Concolato [mailto:Cyril.Concolato@enst.fr] wrote: > Hi Christian, > > > Did someone tried or managed it to create a scene using an > > InputSensor > > (e.g. a KeySensor or MouseSensor)? > > Yes, we did. > > > > I would be interested in the Syntax (in textual description) of the > > ineraction > elementary stream. > You do not need to specify the syntax of the interaction > stream. But you need to specify which kind of device you will > use in conjunction with the InputSensor node. There are > currently three types of devices defined in MPEG: a KeySensor > device, a StringSensor device and a Mouse device. Theses > devices produce some data that the BIFS decoder will > interpret and forward to the scene so that your scene > changes. To have some interaction with the scene, you need to > do two things: > * First specify the type of device that you will use. You do > it by setting the right device name in the > DecoderConfigDescriptor that describes the device stream. > * Second, specify in the scene what you want to do with the > device data. This is done through an InputSensor node linked > to that device stream. As usua, the device stream is > represented by an ObjectDescriptor. This latter is referenced > in the url field of the InputSensor node. Then the buffer of > the node contains as many commands as there are units of data > in the device data. For instance, a mouse will produce X, Y > and a boolean. So there are 3 units of data, hence three > replace commands in the InputSensor. These replace commands > mean: replace some value in the scene with X, replace some > other with Y and finally some other again with the boolean. > > > Does anyone know if the envivoTV plugin is able to play such scene? > Not that I know of. But I do know they are willing to. > > > Any hints are welcome. > Here is a BT file. First of all thank you for the detailed information about this topic. I quoted your complete answer because until now the CC didn't find it's way to the Technotes list. Unfortunately I wasn't able to create a mp4 from your bt file with the current version of mp4tool (it doesn't know the field deviceName in the UIConfig). Is the new version of mp4tool able to convert it? Or did I understand something wrong and you gave this bt just as a "it should be something like this" example? Regards Christian Weigel From harmanci ece.rochester.edu Tue Dec 3 16:22:26 2002 From: harmanci ece.rochester.edu (Oztan Harmanci) Date: Wed Jul 30 14:09:20 2003 Subject: [M4IF Technotes] Error resiliency test tools Message-ID: <009401c29b12$13ba0570$bea49780@h414pc5> Hi. I have a couple of questions about error resiliency simulations. Any help is greatly appreciated. It appears that the roots of the error resiliency tests in the VM go back to N0999 -'95 Tokyo paper. According to the test results -for example- resync marker spacing is advised under different channel conditions and bit rates. Channel is simulated using a "NTT DoCoMo" originated software, and if I didnt understand wrong it uses a two state markov model to simulate the bit errors. Does anyone know where I can find this "NTT DoCoMo" software and whether this software is applicable to 3GPP1/2 network simulations(cdma2000/wcdma type networks)? There is a similar channel simulation testing software for JVT, namely VCEG-N37. The problem with N37 is that it does not allow any errored packets to be passed to upper levels. In other words, bit errors are not allowed. This confuses me: Assuming that N37 software is a valid 3G simulation tool, and that N37 can be changed to simulate MPEG4 transmissions, what is the point of having bit error resiliency if there wont be any? Does that mean MPEG4's bit based error resiliency tools are not needed in 3G networks? This means RVLC and data partitioning become useless! Am I missing something here? Thanks Oztan -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: /pipermail/mp4-tech/attachments/20021203/6ecaf10a/attachment.html From egrab divxnetworks.com Tue Dec 3 15:20:21 2002 From: egrab divxnetworks.com (Eric Grab) Date: Wed Jul 30 14:09:20 2003 Subject: [M4IF Technotes] File Type Box Question & Registering ftyp Message-ID: <92800BEF04DB704192951C1A407CD91D72042E@mrsmith.divxnetworks.com> We are making MP4 files. Seems like the right thing to do is have a file type box that looks like this for our MPEG-4 files: major-brand="divx" (actually the number that represents "divx") minor-version=1 compatible-brands="isom","other1","other2",... (and other numbers) Is this what people are doing when they add file creation tools? Where does one register for an 'ftyp' to get the official number? -- Eric Grab, Director of Engineering, mailto:egrab@divxnetworks.com phoneto:858.909.5311 From sps iis.fhg.de Wed Dec 4 12:06:16 2002 From: sps iis.fhg.de (Ralph Sperschneider) Date: Wed Jul 30 14:09:20 2003 Subject: [M4IF Technotes] help In-Reply-To: <000001c29a7f$8e9c7ea0$92c809c0@system64> References: <000001c29a7f$8e9c7ea0$92c809c0@system64> Message-ID: <3DEDE1A8.6060206@iis.fhg.de> Dear Harisha, harisha wrote: > Hi > > > > We recently purchased ISO reference software for MPEG -4,14496.and I am > working with audio part.But the Ref.code is unable decode the bitstream > supplied by ISO I wonder that only a single bitstream was supplied by ISO. I guess that it was not part of the reference software. Maby you can identify this stream and inform us about its source (e.g. an ftp site or the annex of 14496-4:2000). > It fails in > > > > MP4Audio_LookForSuitableTracks() in MP4ifc.c File > > The function call > > err=MP4GetTrackEnabled(baseTrack,&enabled) > > > > always returns enabled=0 As a first guess, this might be due to a recent (about one year ago) change in the mp4filelib based on a Systems corrigendum. I am not sure whether the software is outdated or your sequence. Most recent conformance test sequences for MPEG-4 Audio are available here: ftp://mpaudconf:adif2mp4@ftp.iis.fhg.de/ Best regards, Ralph > > > > After this program terminates.Will You Please tell me the Solutions to > above Problem. > > > > Thanks. > > > > With regards > > Harisha > -- Dipl.-Ing. Ralph Sperschneider | Phone: +49 9131 776 344 FhG IIS-A | Fax: +49 9131 776 398 Am Wolfsmantel 33 | mailto:sps@iis.fhg.de D 91058 Erlangen | http://www.iis.fhg.de/amm/ From fuchs iis.fhg.de Wed Dec 4 15:30:51 2002 From: fuchs iis.fhg.de (Harald Fuchs) Date: Wed Jul 30 14:09:20 2003 Subject: [M4IF Technotes] File Type Box Question & Registering ftyp In-Reply-To: <92800BEF04DB704192951C1A407CD91D72042E@mrsmith.divxnetworks.com> References: <92800BEF04DB704192951C1A407CD91D72042E@mrsmith.divxnetworks.com> Message-ID: <200212041530.51806.fuchs@iis.fhg.de> On Wednesday 04 December 2023 00:20, Eric Grab wrote: > We are making MP4 files. Seems like the right thing to do is have a file > type box that looks like this for our MPEG-4 files: > > major-brand="divx" (actually the number that represents "divx") > minor-version=1 > compatible-brands="isom","other1","other2",... (and other numbers) > > Is this what people are doing when they add file creation tools? > > Where does one register for an 'ftyp' to get the official number? Hello Eric, the brands identify the file format specification to which the file is compatible. The brand names are not meant for private use, new brand names are registered with ISO only for file format specifications derived from the ISO file format. If you want to create files compatible with MPEG-4 (.mp4 files) you have to use "mp41" or "mp42" as major-brand and at least "isom" as compatible-brand. I try to explain this in more detail: The basis for several file formats is the "ISO Media File Format" standardized as Amendment 5 of MPEG-4 14496-1:2001 (to become a new separate part of MPEG-4: 14496-12) and Amendment 1 of 15444-3 (JPEG 2000). This file format is not used directly, several specific file formats are derived from it like mp4, mj2 (JPEG2000), 3gp. The specific extensions to the base file format are standardized separately, for MPEG-4 in Amendment 6 of 14496-1:2001 (to become a new separate part of MPEG-4: 14496-14). The ISO Media and the MP4 File Format are currently in the FDIS stage of the standardization (the current MPEG internal documents with the text are N5295, N5298; I don't know if the are already available at ISO). Chapter 4.3 of the ISO Media Format (14496-12) describes the file type box, chapter 13.15 of the MP4 File Format (14496-14) describes the MPEG-4 specific extensions to the file type box. The brand "mp41" is used for files compatible with version 1 of the mp4 file format (14496-1:2001) and "mp42" is used for files compatible with version 2 (14496-14:2002/3). Regards, Harald Fuchs From singer apple.com Wed Dec 4 11:34:42 2002 From: singer apple.com (Dave Singer) Date: Wed Jul 30 14:09:20 2003 Subject: [M4IF Technotes] File Type Box Question & Registering ftyp In-Reply-To: <200212041530.51806.fuchs@iis.fhg.de> References: <92800BEF04DB704192951C1A407CD91D72042E@mrsmith.divxnetworks.com> <200212041530.51806.fuchs@iis.fhg.de> Message-ID: At 15:30 +0100 12/4/02, Harald Fuchs wrote: >On Wednesday 04 December 2023 00:20, Eric Grab wrote: >> We are making MP4 files. Seems like the right thing to do is have a file >> type box that looks like this for our MPEG-4 files: >> >> major-brand="divx" (actually the number that >represents "divx") >> minor-version=1 >> >compatible-brands="isom","other1","other2",... >(and other numbers) >> >> Is this what people are doing when they add file creation tools? >> >> Where does one register for an 'ftyp' to get the official number? Um, I am supposed to have an RA running by now. Mea culpa. > >Hello Eric, > >the brands identify the file format specification to which the file is >compatible. The brand names are not meant for private use, new brand names >are registered with ISO only for file format specifications derived from the >ISO file format. > >If you want to create files compatible with MPEG-4 (.mp4 files) you have to >use "mp41" or "mp42" as major-brand and at least >"isom" as compatible-brand. That's not strictly true. You must have mp41 or mp42 as a compatible brand, if you want MPEG-4 compliant readers to expect to be able to decode your file. The major brand might be any other compatible specification. Otherwise what Harald says is both true and helpful. We don't let anyone say what must be the major-brand, because then we risk not being able to make a file that is decodable by two or more standards. So readers should *always* check only compatible brands. Why is there a major-brand then? It identifies what the author thought of as the 'best use' of the file, and usually matches the file-type, extension, mime-type etc. > > >I try to explain this in more detail: > >The basis for several file formats is the "ISO Media File >Format" standardized >as Amendment 5 of MPEG-4 14496-1:2001 (to become a new separate part of >MPEG-4: 14496-12) and Amendment 1 of 15444-3 (JPEG 2000). > >This file format is not used directly, several specific file formats are >derived from it like mp4, mj2 (JPEG2000), 3gp. The specific extensions to the >base file format are standardized separately, for MPEG-4 in Amendment 6 of >14496-1:2001 (to become a new separate part of MPEG-4: 14496-14). > >The ISO Media and the MP4 File Format are currently in the FDIS stage of the >standardization (the current MPEG internal documents with the text are N5295, >N5298; I don't know if the are already available at ISO). > >Chapter 4.3 of the ISO Media Format (14496-12) describes the file type box, >chapter 13.15 of the MP4 File Format (14496-14) describes the MPEG-4 specific >extensions to the file type box. The brand "mp41" is used for files >compatible with version 1 of the mp4 file format (14496-1:2001) and >"mp42" is >used for files compatible with version 2 (14496-14:2002/3). > > >Regards, >Harald Fuchs > >_______________________________________________ >Technotes mailing list >Technotes@lists.m4if.org >http://lists.m4if.org/mailman/listinfo/technotes -- David Singer Apple Computer/QuickTime From ben interframemedia.com Wed Dec 4 15:25:13 2002 From: ben interframemedia.com (Ben Waggoner) Date: Wed Jul 30 14:09:21 2003 Subject: [M4IF Technotes] NerdTV encoder chosen Message-ID: Everybody, Thanks for everyone's help with the codec evaluation for the Robert X. Cringely Nerd TV project. Since this likely will be the biggest audience for an all MPEG-4 project yet, by a good order of magnitude, we spent the time to make sure we could get the best results possible. Because I consult for a number of different MPEG-4 companies, I decided it was best that I take myself out of the final decision about codec quality. First, I spent several weeks with the encoders making sure I could get the best results out of each. I assigned a randomized number to each vendor, and supplied Bob and his crew with these files, with no indication of which vendors did which. I didn't indicate any workflow issues with these files, but didn't provide samples from tools that simply didn't provide adequate workflow for our needs. The target specs were 320x240 25 fps Simple Visual @ 100 Kbps, with 22.050 KHz 24 Kbps mono AAC-LC audio, all encoded for progressive download. We didn't look at other combinations in any formal way, so don't extrapolate from our results too broadly. The unanimous pick (all viewers agreed it was better for all samples) was the beta of Sorenson Squeeze 3.0. Which is priced at US$119! The close runner up was Envivio Encoding Station, with the other encoders in a pack somewhat behind that, and with QuickTime's encoder dead last (which concerns me, since many are using it to demo MPEG-4 quality). I note that both Squeeze and EES support 2-pass VBR encoding, which is a big help with this kind of long-form progressive download content. And while we didn't judge it in this regard, Squeeze also provided the best workflow of any of the tools, again with EES as the closest runner up. Since I'm under NDA with a number of the encoders, I won't be providing a full list and results here. If I did test your encoder, expect in the next few days a more detailed report from me describing how your particular product fared. I'm writing a feature for the April issue of DV Magazine (out in late February) describing the initial phase of Nerd TV, including more details on the codec shootout. And remember, I can consult for you too! If you're building MPEG-4 tools, or implementing MPEG-4 in your organization, drop me a line privately if you'd like to discuss how I can help you out. Ben Waggoner Compressed Video Consulting, Training, and Encoding My Book: http://www.benwaggoner.com/books.htm Cleaner Tutorial: http://www.saferseas.com/navseries/adclean.html Compression Books: http://www.benwaggoner.com/bookshelf.htm From shanmuga ti.com Thu Dec 5 10:52:46 2002 From: shanmuga ti.com (Mahendran, Shanmuga Sundaram) Date: Wed Jul 30 14:09:21 2003 Subject: [M4IF Technotes] Number of Channels Message-ID: Hi, How to get number of channels of audio stream present in MPEG4 file format file? From naidu sasken.com Thu Dec 5 13:03:15 2002 From: naidu sasken.com (A V S Y Naidu) Date: Wed Jul 30 14:09:21 2003 Subject: [M4IF Technotes] Number of Channels In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Hi, You can get it from Decoder_specific_info presented in ES_Descriptor of partricular audio track. regards, naidu On Thu, 5 Dec 2002, Mahendran, Shanmuga Sundaram wrote: > Hi, > > How to get number of channels of audio stream present in MPEG4 file format > file? > > >From where can I get 3GPP files? > > Regards, > Shanmuga Sundaram M. > > > From olivier.avaro rd.francetelecom.com Thu Dec 5 11:22:38 2002 From: olivier.avaro rd.francetelecom.com (AVARO Olivier FTRD/DIH/REN) Date: Wed Jul 30 14:09:21 2003 Subject: [M4IF Technotes] Number of Channels Message-ID: <571B06D35309794BA9204B5A090CC10101A15ABF@lanmhs50.rd.francetelecom.fr> > You can get it from Decoder_specific_info presented in > ES_Descriptor > of partricular audio track. I don't think this is mandatorily present in 3GPP branded files. Maybe another good reason to multi-brand your files and have MP4 branding as the common denominator so that we avoid YAMM (yet another multimedia mess). Kind regards, Olivier From olivier.avaro rd.francetelecom.com Thu Dec 5 11:36:58 2002 From: olivier.avaro rd.francetelecom.com (AVARO Olivier FTRD/DIH/REN) Date: Wed Jul 30 14:09:21 2003 Subject: [M4IF Technotes] File Type Box Question & Registering ftyp Message-ID: <571B06D35309794BA9204B5A090CC10101A15AC5@lanmhs50.rd.francetelecom.fr> > The ISO Media and the MP4 File Format are currently in the > FDIS stage of the > standardization (the current MPEG internal documents with the > text are N5295, > N5298; I don't know if the are already available at ISO). No, not yet published but they are, as you say, at a final stage (no more changes possible). cu, O. From kevin814 hotmail.com Thu Dec 5 11:19:21 2002 From: kevin814 hotmail.com (Ma Gang) Date: Wed Jul 30 14:09:21 2003 Subject: [M4IF Technotes] About VTC decoder in MoMuSys Message-ID: Hi,engineer I have researched the VTC decoder in MoMuSys, and I found it can work when the samples without shape information, If there are shape information in the samples, the MoMuSys can not decode it correctly, I found the reason is the data in the sample has been read to the end, I think it must be caused by the shape mask, Did you meet this problem?? and who can tell me how to solve it? Best Regards! Kevin 12/05/2024 _________________________________________________________________ гыСЊЛњЕФХѓгбНјааНЛСїЃЌЧыЪЙгУ MSN Messenger: http://messenger.msn.com/cn From emre.aksu nokia.com Thu Dec 5 14:50:53 2002 From: emre.aksu nokia.com (emre.aksu@nokia.com) Date: Wed Jul 30 14:09:21 2003 Subject: [M4IF Technotes] Number of Channels Message-ID: Hi, > > You can get it from Decoder_specific_info presented in > > ES_Descriptor > > of partricular audio track. > I don't think this is mandatorily present in 3GPP branded files. For 3GP files containing MPEG-4 Audio media track, the Decoder Specific Information is always present in the ESD Box of this particular track's AudioSampleEntry Box and the number of channels can be extracted from this location. For 3GP files having AMR Narrow Band or AMR Wide Band, Olivier is correct. There is no ESD Box present. The reason is simple. AMR-NB and AMR-WB audio media track is always mono and one-channel, hence no need to signal channel information. BR, Emre Emre Baris Aksu Nokia Mobile Phones Tieteenkatu 1 FIN-33720 Tampere-FINLAND > -----Original Message----- > From: ext AVARO Olivier FTRD/DIH/REN > [mailto:olivier.avaro@rd.francetelecom.com] > Sent: 05 December, 2002 12:23 > To: A V S Y Naidu; Mahendran, Shanmuga Sundaram > Cc: technotes@lists.m4if.org > Subject: RE: [M4IF Technotes] Number of Channels > > > > > You can get it from Decoder_specific_info presented in > > ES_Descriptor > > of partricular audio track. > I don't think this is mandatorily present in 3GPP branded files. > Maybe another good reason to multi-brand your files and have MP4 > branding as the common denominator so that we avoid YAMM (yet another > multimedia mess). > > Kind regards, > Olivier > _______________________________________________ > Technotes mailing list > Technotes@lists.m4if.org > http://lists.m4if.org/mailman/listinfo/technotes > From pantaloonmc hotmail.com Thu Dec 5 11:38:52 2002 From: pantaloonmc hotmail.com (Padraig Murphy) Date: Wed Jul 30 14:09:21 2003 Subject: [M4IF Technotes] video sync layer Message-ID: Hello, I am interested in locating a simple video and/or audio bitstream that has been passed through the sync layer. Does anyone know where I could find one, thanks, Padraig _________________________________________________________________ Add photos to your messages with MSN 8. Get 2 months FREE*. http://join.msn.com/?page=features/featuredemail From jean1001 hotmail.com Thu Dec 5 20:51:40 2002 From: jean1001 hotmail.com (SeA JeAn) Date: Wed Jul 30 14:09:21 2003 Subject: [M4IF Technotes] MMS code encoder issue Message-ID: Hi, Experts: In MMS original code , Intra period is 333, when I set bit Rate is 1120K/Sec, the encode results is right, But If I set Intra period is 15,( I = 1, P = 14). the encoder result 1th, 6th, 11th, 16th,21th, 26th,...... is abnormal, there are garbage when playback results. what's cause this problem? Pls give me some advice, Thanks a million? Regards --SeA JeAn Get more from the Web. FREE MSN Explorer download : http://explorer.msn.com -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: /pipermail/mp4-tech/attachments/20021205/be96b11b/attachment.html From singer apple.com Thu Dec 5 10:55:07 2002 From: singer apple.com (Dave Singer) Date: Wed Jul 30 14:09:21 2003 Subject: [M4IF Technotes] Number of Channels In-Reply-To: <571B06D35309794BA9204B5A090CC10101A15ABF@lanmhs50.rd.francetelecom.fr> References: <571B06D35309794BA9204B5A090CC10101A15ABF@lanmhs50.rd.francetelecom.fr> Message-ID: At 11:22 +0100 12/5/02, AVARO Olivier FTRD/DIH/REN wrote: > > You can get it from Decoder_specific_info presented in >> ES_Descriptor >> of partricular audio track. >I don't think this is mandatorily present in 3GPP branded files. >Maybe another good reason to multi-brand your files and have MP4 >branding as the common denominator so that we avoid YAMM (yet another >multimedia mess). Ah, the only codecs that 3G uses are (a) AMR-NB and -WB, which I believe are definitively mono and (b) AAC, for which you get the DSI. So I think we're still safely in UMM (usual multimedia mess)! -- David Singer Apple Computer/QuickTime From Gerardo.Rosiles motorola.com Thu Dec 5 17:49:03 2002 From: Gerardo.Rosiles motorola.com (Rosiles Gerardo-ra9355) Date: Wed Jul 30 14:09:21 2003 Subject: [M4IF Technotes] reference code advise Message-ID: <6728517EECE7D511981B00D0B78290310355ECAC@az33exm27.corp.mot.com> Skipped content of type multipart/alternative-------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: Gerardo Rosiles (ra9355) (E-mail).vcf Type: application/octet-stream Size: 168 bytes Desc: not available Url : /pipermail/mp4-tech/attachments/20021205/e10adbb9/GerardoRosilesra9355E-mail.exe From Phu Cheertek.com.tw Fri Dec 6 09:26:52 2002 From: Phu Cheertek.com.tw (D400 Phu) Date: Wed Jul 30 14:09:22 2003 Subject: [M4IF Technotes] reference code advise Message-ID: <82C0D25D805EA64DA50B2F14904E89F97856B2@cthqml01.Cheertek.com.tw> To my knowledge, C code MoMuSys is implemed based on Unix while C++ Microsoft code on Windows.. There are some minor glitches on MoMusys Dec 2000 version such as interlaced ... If your target is to tranplant to an embedded platform.. C version MMS will be convenient.. http://www.iso.ch/iso/en/ittf/PubliclyAvailableStandards The official souce code can be obtained from ISO/IEC site ... however you need to try many times due to busy networks... Dvix is an ASP profile of MP4, DVix can decode bitstreams created from MMS ,MS... Best Po-Chin -----Original Message----- From: Rosiles Gerardo-ra9355 [mailto:Gerardo.Rosiles@motorola.com] Sent: Friday, December 06, 2023 8:49 AM To: 'technotes@lists.m4if.org' Subject: [M4IF Technotes] reference code advise Hello, I am newcomer to this list, and recent student of MPEG-4. I have done some searching for reference code and have found a few options that people in this group must know. I would like to request advise on which of this code bases is more recommended for merely doing quality vs. bitrate comparisons between AS, ASP, and also MPEG-2 (I do have a codec for this). This is what I have dig out from the web: MoMuSys-FDIS-V1.0-990812 microsoft-vfdis-v10-990812 MoMuSys-FPdAM1-1.0-001220_sony-021017_KDDI MoMuSys-FDPAM1-1.0-021915_nctu I understand the naming convention, but I wonder if there is any preference amongst the community towards a particular version. In particular, I found it cumbersome the way the -990812 codes require to arrange each input frame on a separate directory. Is there any version that reads a single concatenated YUV file? Also got the code for Xvid and MPEG4IP. Are these any better than the above? Finally I am trying to understand what is the role of MPEG-4 in DivX. Is the main difference that the file format they are using is not standarized, or are there any other significant differences (from the decoder perspective)? Thanks for your help, -Gerardo Gerardo Rosiles - Advanced Solutions Group Gerardo.Rosiles@motorola.com 32-bit Embedded Controller Division, Austin TX -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: /pipermail/mp4-tech/attachments/20021206/ed3833fc/attachment.html From kevin814 hotmail.com Fri Dec 6 01:48:21 2002 From: kevin814 hotmail.com (Ma Kevin) Date: Wed Jul 30 14:09:22 2003 Subject: [M4IF Technotes] about: vtc decoder Message-ID: An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: /pipermail/mp4-tech/attachments/20021206/1c158bbd/attachment.html From rob.koenen m4if.org Thu Dec 5 19:57:27 2002 From: rob.koenen m4if.org (Rob Koenen) Date: Wed Jul 30 14:09:22 2003 Subject: [M4IF Technotes] reference code advise In-Reply-To: <82C0D25D805EA64DA50B2F14904E89F97856B2@cthqml01.Cheertek.com.tw> Message-ID: <3C124172E7FDD511B510000347426D59016BEB11@exchange.epr.com> Gerardo, The reference code is not optimized. A better idea of quality vs bitrate is probably obtained using a commercial product. DivX video coding is supposed to be compliant, the file format is different as I understand it. As you can see from the M4IF home page, DivXNetworks recently joined the M4IF interop program. I will send you a Motorola person to contact for more info in a private email. Rob -----Original Message----- From: D400 Phu [mailto:Phu@Cheertek.com.tw] Sent: Thursday, December 05, 2023 5:27 PM To: Rosiles Gerardo-ra9355 Cc: technotes@lists.m4if.org Subject: RE: [M4IF Technotes] reference code advise To my knowledge, C code MoMuSys is implemed based on Unix while C++ Microsoft code on Windows.. There are some minor glitches on MoMusys Dec 2000 version such as interlaced ... If your target is to tranplant to an embedded platform.. C version MMS will be convenient.. http://www.iso.ch/iso/en/ittf/PubliclyAvailableStandards The official souce code can be obtained from ISO/IEC site ... however you need to try many times due to busy networks... Dvix is an ASP profile of MP4, DVix can decode bitstreams created from MMS ,MS... Best Po-Chin -----Original Message----- From: Rosiles Gerardo-ra9355 [mailto:Gerardo.Rosiles@motorola.com] Sent: Friday, December 06, 2023 8:49 AM To: 'technotes@lists.m4if.org' Subject: [M4IF Technotes] reference code advise Hello, I am newcomer to this list, and recent student of MPEG-4. I have done some searching for reference code and have found a few options that people in this group must know. I would like to request advise on which of this code bases is more recommended for merely doing quality vs. bitrate comparisons between AS, ASP, and also MPEG-2 (I do have a codec for this). This is what I have dig out from the web: MoMuSys-FDIS-V1.0-990812 microsoft-vfdis-v10-990812 MoMuSys-FPdAM1-1.0-001220_sony-021017_KDDI MoMuSys-FDPAM1-1.0-021915_nctu I understand the naming convention, but I wonder if there is any preference amongst the community towards a particular version. In particular, I found it cumbersome the way the -990812 codes require to arrange each input frame on a separate directory. Is there any version that reads a single concatenated YUV file? Also got the code for Xvid and MPEG4IP. Are these any better than the above? Finally I am trying to understand what is the role of MPEG-4 in DivX. Is the main difference that the file format they are using is not standarized, or are there any other significant differences (from the decoder perspective)? Thanks for your help, -Gerardo Gerardo Rosiles - Advanced Solutions Group Gerardo.Rosiles@motorola.com 32-bit Embedded Controller Division, Austin TX -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: /pipermail/mp4-tech/attachments/20021205/8bb69aa1/attachment.html From ben interframemedia.com Thu Dec 5 21:00:24 2002 From: ben interframemedia.com (Ben Waggoner) Date: Wed Jul 30 14:09:22 2003 Subject: [M4IF Technotes] About DivX ( Was Re: reference code advise) In-Reply-To: <3C124172E7FDD511B510000347426D59016BEB11@exchange.epr.com> Message-ID: Rob, Specifically, most DivX files use MPEG-4 (simple or advanced simple) video and MP3 audio in the AVI file format. These are obviously not MPEG-4 compliant. They sometimes use VBR MP3 audio, which isn't really AVI compliant either, which is why tools like QuickTime often have sync issues playing back .divx files. DivX 4 was Simple only, and DivX 5 is Simple or Advanced Simple. DivX 3 was a hacked version of the early MS MPEG-4 codecs that weren't compliant with the final MPEG-4 spec. Lots of these are still around, alas. .AVI doesn't have any technical advantages over MPEG-4, and many many disadvantages, so it'd be great if DivXNetworks would adopt .mp4 with AAC audio as their standard file format. Their tools can do .mp4 export right now, but without audio. They weren't included in the NerdTV shootout for that reason. Their video codec is quite good, though. 2-pass support and some novel quality optimization techniques. Ben Waggoner Compressed Video Consulting, Training, and Encoding My Book: http://www.benwaggoner.com/books.htm Compression Books: http://www.benwaggoner.com/bookshelf.htm on 12/5/02 19:57, Rob Koenen at rob.koenen@m4if.org wrote: > DivX video coding is supposed to be compliant, the file format is different > as I understand it. As you can see from the M4IF home page, DivXNetworks > recently joined the M4IF interop program. From rob.koenen m4if.org Thu Dec 5 21:38:41 2002 From: rob.koenen m4if.org (Rob Koenen) Date: Wed Jul 30 14:09:22 2003 Subject: [M4IF Technotes] About DivX ( Was Re: reference code advise) In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <3C124172E7FDD511B510000347426D59016BEB14@exchange.epr.com> I'm sure someone is listening :-) Rob > -----Original Message----- > From: Ben Waggoner [mailto:ben@interframemedia.com] > Sent: Thursday, December 05, 2023 9:00 PM > To: technotes@lists.m4if.org > Subject: [M4IF Technotes] About DivX ( Was Re: reference code advise) > > > Rob, > > Specifically, most DivX files use MPEG-4 (simple or > advanced simple) video and MP3 audio in the AVI file format. > These are obviously not MPEG-4 compliant. They sometimes use > VBR MP3 audio, which isn't really AVI compliant either, which > is why tools like QuickTime often have sync issues playing > back .divx files. > > DivX 4 was Simple only, and DivX 5 is Simple or Advanced > Simple. DivX 3 was a hacked version of the early MS MPEG-4 > codecs that weren't compliant with the final MPEG-4 spec. > Lots of these are still around, alas. > > .AVI doesn't have any technical advantages over MPEG-4, > and many many disadvantages, so it'd be great if DivXNetworks > would adopt .mp4 with AAC audio as their standard file > format. Their tools can do .mp4 export right now, but > without audio. They weren't included in the NerdTV shootout > for that reason. Their video codec is quite good, though. > 2-pass support and some novel quality optimization techniques. > > Ben Waggoner > Compressed Video Consulting, Training, and Encoding > > My Book: http://www.benwaggoner.com/books.htm > Compression Books: http://www.benwaggoner.com/bookshelf.htm > > > > on 12/5/02 19:57, Rob Koenen at rob.koenen@m4if.org wrote: > > > DivX video coding is supposed to be compliant, the file format is > > different as I understand it. As you can see from the M4IF > home page, > > DivXNetworks recently joined the M4IF interop program. > > > _______________________________________________ > Technotes mailing list > Technotes@lists.m4if.org > http://lists.m4if.org/mailman/listinfo/technot> es > From liuxiaolei vip.sina.com Fri Dec 6 09:41:58 2002 From: liuxiaolei vip.sina.com (liuxiaolei@vip.sina.com) Date: Wed Jul 30 14:09:22 2003 Subject: [M4IF Technotes] Question of MPEG4 Message-ID: <20021206014158.28494.qmail@vip.sina.com> > > Dear MPEG4 Experts, > > > > In the MPEG-4 spec. (ISO 14496-2), Sprite decoding is in > > Section 7.8 .We know Sprite decoding is decoding for > > S(sprite)-VOP and the sprite decoding process is : > > I-vopBitstream,Shape/TextureDecoding,Sprite Buffer; > > S-VOPBitstream,Shape/TextureDecoding, > > Warping Vector coding,Warping,Reconstructed > > Samples; > > Now my question is: > > What is Warping and Warping Vector? > > Why used warping? > > I hope receive result,very thanks! > > > > Thanks > > Xiaolei Liu > > ______________________________________ =================================================================== From gchandra tataelxsi.co.in Fri Dec 6 15:01:32 2002 From: gchandra tataelxsi.co.in (Chandra Sekhar Reddy G) Date: Wed Jul 30 14:09:22 2003 Subject: [M4IF Technotes] MP4 and QT Compatibility Message-ID: <006201c29d0a$43e65ec0$cc28010a@gchandra> Hi, We all know that MP4-File-Format is derived (based on or taken as starting point) from QuickTime-File-Format. Now, MP4 handles Scene-Description and Object/ES Descriptors (IOD/OD ...) also. How there are handled in QuickTime? Say, if we were to convert MP4 to/from QuickTime, is it always completely/acurately possible without loosing any information? Regards, Chandra From hagai enquad.com Fri Dec 6 15:32:32 2002 From: hagai enquad.com (Hagai Folkman) Date: Wed Jul 30 14:09:22 2003 Subject: [M4IF Technotes] Question of MPEG4 References: <20021206014158.28494.qmail@vip.sina.com> Message-ID: <005e01c29d2b$f08fb6a0$e773003e@default> Wraping represent the changes of the Sprite image in time. Wraping vector represent the change from the last Sprite, the decoder reconstruct the Sprite image from the wraping vector. The Wraping vector is 3x3 parametric matrix that represent linear movements (like pan and tilt) or non-linear movements (like zoom or rotate). The wrapping can be used to send still image and afterward to manipulate the image, or for sending the background of the video and change the background according to the camera movements. Hagai Folkman, ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: щхэ љщљщ 06 уіюсј 2002 03:41 Subject: [M4IF Technotes] Question of MPEG4 > > > > Dear MPEG4 Experts, > > > > > > In the MPEG-4 spec. (ISO 14496-2), Sprite decoding is in > > > Section 7.8 .We know Sprite decoding is decoding for > > > S(sprite)-VOP and the sprite decoding process is : > > > I-vopBitstream,Shape/TextureDecoding,Sprite Buffer; > > > S-VOPBitstream,Shape/TextureDecoding, > > > Warping Vector coding,Warping,Reconstructed > > > Samples; > > > Now my question is: > > > What is Warping and Warping Vector? > > > Why used warping? > > > I hope receive result,very thanks! > > > > > > Thanks > > > Xiaolei Liu > > > > ______________________________________ > > =================================================================== > _______________________________________________ > Technotes mailing list > Technotes@lists.m4if.org > http://lists.m4if.org/mailman/listinfo/technotes From ben interframemedia.com Fri Dec 6 10:11:41 2002 From: ben interframemedia.com (Ben Waggoner) Date: Wed Jul 30 14:09:22 2003 Subject: [M4IF Technotes] MP4 and QT Compatibility In-Reply-To: <006201c29d0a$43e65ec0$cc28010a@gchandra> Message-ID: Chandra, Alas, no. You can losslessly transcode the video and audio tracks of a file, but interactivity and other object based stuff is very different in QuickTime compared to MPEG-4. MPEG-4 uses the VRML-derived BIFS, while QuickTime uses something called Wired Sprites. Ben Waggoner Compressed Video Consulting, Training, and Encoding My Book: http://www.benwaggoner.com/books.htm Compression Books: http://www.benwaggoner.com/bookshelf.htm on 12/6/02 1:31, Chandra Sekhar Reddy G at gchandra@tataelxsi.co.in wrote: > We all know that > MP4-File-Format is derived (based on or taken as starting point) from > QuickTime-File-Format. > > Now, MP4 handles Scene-Description and Object/ES Descriptors (IOD/OD ...) > also. > How there are handled in QuickTime? > > Say, if we were to convert MP4 to/from QuickTime, > is it always completely/acurately possible without loosing any information? From dnthompson divxnetworks.com Fri Dec 6 10:24:37 2002 From: dnthompson divxnetworks.com (Darrius "Junto" Thompson) Date: Wed Jul 30 14:09:23 2003 Subject: [M4IF Technotes] About DivX ( Was Re: reference code advise) Message-ID: <92800BEF04DB704192951C1A407CD91D63DDDA@mrsmith.divxnetworks.com> Ben, > > Specifically, most DivX files use MPEG-4 (simple or > > advanced simple) video and MP3 audio in the AVI file format. > > These are obviously not MPEG-4 compliant. The DivX Codec is just that, a video codec that compresses the video bitstream and uses a standard interface to interact with just about any PC video editing or encoding application using the Video for Windows or DirectShow interface. This means it is a plugin for compression of the video stream and in itself is not a tool for muxing the audio and video. The actual file wrapper is generally implemented as part of an editing or encoding application. Look at Quicktime Pro, Adobe Premiere, etc.. and you'll see that you can pick any video codec that you have available and pick a different file format to encapsulate the actual audio, video, or other multimedia components within the stream. The codec is the video compression plugin for applications and the application usually includes several choices for file wrapping or muxing. This also allows anyone video professional to use their file format of choice. The file wrapper is a seperate component from the video codec. If we forced everyone to use a different file format which is then not supported in their application of choice the video codec would not be able to be used or supported within their application. Even within the technote threads everyone keeps asking for tools that can support the MP4 file format so there is an obvious lack of tools available not only to general consumers but to the video market as a whole. However, they will exist and we (DivX) will be pushing foward in creating these tools. We provide the codec in a way that can be used today while we're also very rapidly building MP4 tools such as MP4 Interoperable file wrapper plugins with some interesting features that can be used within atoms. (coming soon) These will be available off of our site in the coming weeks and months. While we'll also be pushing the plugins into many partner consumer products. > > Specifically, most DivX files use MPEG-4 (simple or > > advanced simple) video and MP3 audio In regards to MP3 audio. We have the same approach here, and isn't MP3 audio compliant within MP4? We provide a video codec plugin and we allow the end user to pick their audio format of choice. The consumer should be given the choice. The other piece that must be taken into consideration is consumer electronics. With DivX Certified devices are already hitting the market this year and many more next year, these devices and hardware generally all support MP3 audio today and to support other audio format obviously adds to the cost of materials in building these devices. The choice of audio formats for support in these devices is also the Consumer Electronic manufacturers choice for what they will provide their customers. MP4 AAC will gain adoption and users, as they do today, will have the choice of using any audio format within their applications along with DivX video :) > > .AVI doesn't have any technical advantages over MPEG-4, > > and many many disadvantages Yes that's somewhat true. And again, the choice of file wrapper is provided by the end users application. As mentioned an MP4 Interoperable file format plugin and application is in the works. And remember AVI has one advantage: It is supported in consumer level and professional video applications. The MP4 file format is not yet supported, but as mentioned, we will work with partners to provide the support. For simple video editing where there is only a concern video and audio, AVI works fine, but when you want to have more "interesting" features the MP4 file format is the way to go. It is these interesting features that we provide consumers within the MP4 file format. If a consumer wants to encode and edit video with just audio and video and are not concerned with anything else there needs to be a more compelling reason to use the MP4 file format. We will provide features that add value to consumers but still gives our users the choice of tools and technology. Whatever tools are best (easy to use, feature rich) within their category will win for end consumers. So the full system of MP4 must be compelling before all the pieces (file format, audio, etc..) are used by general consumers creating and editing content. As a whole we can all create the tools necessary that will give consumers a reason for using the full suite of MP4 tools since they will make the choice of tools. Darrius Thompson Director DivX 858-909-5307 http://www.divx.com > I'm sure someone is listening :-) P.S. Thanks Rob :) > -----Original Message----- > From: Rob Koenen [mailto:rob.koenen@m4if.org] > Sent: Thursday, December 05, 2023 9:39 PM > To: 'Ben Waggoner'; technotes@lists.m4if.org > Subject: RE: [M4IF Technotes] About DivX ( Was Re: reference code > advise) > > > I'm sure someone is listening :-) > > Rob > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: Ben Waggoner [mailto:ben@interframemedia.com] > > Sent: Thursday, December 05, 2023 9:00 PM > > To: technotes@lists.m4if.org > > Subject: [M4IF Technotes] About DivX ( Was Re: reference > code advise) > > > > > > Rob, > > > > Specifically, most DivX files use MPEG-4 (simple or > > advanced simple) video and MP3 audio in the AVI file format. > > These are obviously not MPEG-4 compliant. They sometimes use > > VBR MP3 audio, which isn't really AVI compliant either, which > > is why tools like QuickTime often have sync issues playing > > back .divx files. > > > > DivX 4 was Simple only, and DivX 5 is Simple or Advanced > > Simple. DivX 3 was a hacked version of the early MS MPEG-4 > > codecs that weren't compliant with the final MPEG-4 spec. > > Lots of these are still around, alas. > > > > .AVI doesn't have any technical advantages over MPEG-4, > > and many many disadvantages, so it'd be great if DivXNetworks > > would adopt .mp4 with AAC audio as their standard file > > format. Their tools can do .mp4 export right now, but > > without audio. They weren't included in the NerdTV shootout > > for that reason. Their video codec is quite good, though. > > 2-pass support and some novel quality optimization techniques. > > > > Ben Waggoner > > Compressed Video Consulting, Training, and Encoding > > > > My Book: http://www.benwaggoner.com/books.htm > > Compression Books: http://www.benwaggoner.com/bookshelf.htm > > > > > > > > on 12/5/02 19:57, Rob Koenen at rob.koenen@m4if.org wrote: > > > > > DivX video coding is supposed to be compliant, the file format is > > > different as I understand it. As you can see from the M4IF > > home page, > > > DivXNetworks recently joined the M4IF interop program. > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Technotes mailing list > > Technotes@lists.m4if.org > > http://lists.m4if.org/mailman/listinfo/technot> es > > > > _______________________________________________ > Technotes mailing list > Technotes@lists.m4if.org > http://lists.m4if.org/mailman/listinfo/technotes > From olivier.avaro rd.francetelecom.com Sat Dec 7 09:48:30 2002 From: olivier.avaro rd.francetelecom.com (AVARO Olivier FTRD/DIH/REN) Date: Wed Jul 30 14:09:23 2003 Subject: [M4IF Technotes] MP4 and QT Compatibility Message-ID: <571B06D35309794BA9204B5A090CC10101A15CAE@lanmhs50.rd.francetelecom.fr> Dear Ben, all, > Alas, no. You can losslessly transcode the video and > audio tracks of a > file, but interactivity and other object based stuff is very > different in > QuickTime compared to MPEG-4. MPEG-4 uses the VRML-derived > BIFS, while > QuickTime uses something called Wired Sprites. Well, I would tend to disagree with this. Although I have not seen it done, yet, I have seen transcoding from SMIL/SVG, Flash, Powerpoint, ... to MPEG-4, including interactivity. From liuxiaolei vip.sina.com Mon Dec 9 10:10:19 2002 From: liuxiaolei vip.sina.com (liuxiaolei@vip.sina.com) Date: Wed Jul 30 14:09:23 2003 Subject: [M4IF Technotes] Questions of GMC and Interlace in MPEG4 Message-ID: <20021209021019.19128.qmail@vip.sina.com> Dear MPEG4 Experts, I receive your mail of Warping and Warping Vector in Sprite decoding,very thanks! In the MPEG-4 spec. (ISO 14496-2), GMC(global motion compensation) decoding is in Section 7.8.7. We know the candidate predictor is obtained as the averaged value of the pel-wise motion vectors in the block when mcsel == ЁЎ1ЁЏin GMC decoding. Averaged value of pel-wise vectors is calculated using the all luminance pixels in the macroblock. In Interlaced interlaced intra blocks,We know the positions of top field blocks and buttom field blocks. Now my questions is: How obtained the per luminance pixel motion vectors? How show of top field blocks and buttom field blocks in display when decoding over, one by one show or first show all the top field blocks afterward show all the buttom field blocks? Thanks! Xiaolei Liu ______________________________________ =================================================================== From d98rolb stud.hh.se Mon Dec 9 20:32:17 2002 From: d98rolb stud.hh.se (Roland Bengtsson) Date: Wed Jul 30 14:09:23 2003 Subject: [M4IF Technotes] FGS and frequencies Message-ID: <5.2.0.9.0.20021209202733.031a4fe8@studpop.hh.se> Is it correct to say that the baselayer on FGS contain the lowest frequencies in a frame and the enhancement layer contain higher frequencies in bitplanes? The highest bitplane contain the highest frequency and will be removed first if a degration of quality is done. Is FGS in MPEG-4 the same as signal-to-noise scalability? I would be thankful if someone would clarify this for me. Regards Roland -------------- next part -------------- --- Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.423 / Virus Database: 238 - Release Date: 2023-11-25 From sunx pollux.usc.edu Mon Dec 9 12:13:59 2002 From: sunx pollux.usc.edu (sunx) Date: Wed Jul 30 14:09:23 2003 Subject: [M4IF Technotes] FGS and frequencies In-Reply-To: <5.2.0.9.0.20021209202733.031a4fe8@studpop.hh.se> Message-ID: No, FGS encodes the bitstream into the base layer using the coarse quantization parameter. The difference between the reconstructed base layer and the original bitstream is encoded using DCT. The differential DCT coefficients are stored in form of bit planes. I think SNR scalability is implemented in Amendment 2 and FGS is implemented in Amendment 4. On Mon, 9 Dec 2002, Roland Bengtsson wrote: > Is it correct to say that the baselayer on FGS contain the lowest > frequencies in a frame and the enhancement layer contain higher frequencies > in bitplanes? The highest bitplane contain the highest frequency and will > be removed first if a degration of quality is done. > > Is FGS in MPEG-4 the same as signal-to-noise scalability? > > I would be thankful if someone would clarify this for me. > > Regards Roland > From kevin814 hotmail.com Tue Dec 10 03:13:59 2002 From: kevin814 hotmail.com (Kevin Ma) Date: Wed Jul 30 14:09:23 2003 Subject: [M4IF Technotes] (no subject) Message-ID: An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: /pipermail/mp4-tech/attachments/20021210/f38017c2/attachment.html From hanxy magima.com.cn Tue Dec 10 17:34:25 2002 From: hanxy magima.com.cn (hanxy) Date: Wed Jul 30 14:09:23 2003 Subject: [M4IF Technotes] Help for calculating PTS in PES Message-ID: <001101c2a02f$5448a7f0$b800000a@sh.magima.com> Hi, all I have question about how to calculating correct PTS for access unit which isn't the first access unit contained in this PES, I don't want to get the PTS via fps calculation. It is from the 13818-1 that combining the byte-number of that access unit and the transport rate can reach the goal, but I don't know the detail. Thanks in advance! Regards, Speer -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: /pipermail/mp4-tech/attachments/20021210/58a2bb1e/attachment.html From Gerardo.Rosiles motorola.com Wed Dec 11 11:27:46 2002 From: Gerardo.Rosiles motorola.com (Rosiles Gerardo-ra9355) Date: Wed Jul 30 14:09:23 2003 Subject: [M4IF Technotes] video windowing Message-ID: <6728517EECE7D511981B00D0B78290310355ECB7@az33exm27.corp.mot.com> Skipped content of type multipart/alternative-------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: Gerardo Rosiles (ra9355) (E-mail).vcf Type: application/octet-stream Size: 168 bytes Desc: not available Url : /pipermail/mp4-tech/attachments/20021211/3c89eadf/GerardoRosilesra9355E-mail.exe From valixdi libero.it Thu Dec 12 10:17:54 2002 From: valixdi libero.it (=?iso-8859-1?Q?valixdi@libero.it?=) Date: Wed Jul 30 14:09:23 2003 Subject: [M4IF Technotes] =?iso-8859-1?Q?MoMuSys_for_Windows?= Message-ID: Hello, My name?s Valentina. I am studing at the Perugia?s University (Italy). I work for my thesis on MPEG4 codec, using your MoMuSys software project. I hope you can help me with my problem: I should use the software on windows platform, Visual C++ 6. Could you send me some suggestion to do this ? Thanks for the attention. valixdi@libero.it From guraaf yahoo.co.in Fri Dec 13 20:10:24 2002 From: guraaf yahoo.co.in (Gaurav Aggarwal) Date: Wed Jul 30 14:09:23 2003 Subject: [M4IF Technotes] Error resilience -- what does it mean to discard a MB? Message-ID: <001c01c2a2b5$926e07e0$7810840a@blr.broadcom.com> Sorry for being a little naive and not searching through archives closely to understand the issue. My query relates to error resilience tools of MPEG-4 SP/ASP. I am having trouble with the term "discard a macroblock" based on the four stragies desribed in the Annex E of the Visual Spec (part 2). In short, for an I-VOP, the DC coefficients are together and the AC separate. Suppose, the AC coefficients have a problem for a few macroblocks. Now, for the corresponding macroblock, should I display the "DC" uniform 16x16 patch, or should I use the macroblock at the corresponding location in the previous picture? Also, should I use this erroneous macroblock for DC/AC coeff prediction and for motion prediction? I guess, do not use for either. Finally, the Annex E says that for an I-VOP, do not display it if the four strategies say that its fine to use a macroblock. Doesn't this imply that reversible VLCs have NO meaning for an I-VOP, because each macroblock will be intra, and hence no need bothering to decode the AC coefficients in reverse direction because anyway an intra-MB will not be decoded... Would really appreciate if you can point me to some reference implementation or other relevant sources. And BTW, is handling of errors using the 4 strategies "normative" or informative. Do I need to definitely support RVLC in backward direction and Data Partitioning to be truly MPEG-4 SP compliant? Thanks, Gaurav ________________________________________________________________________ Missed your favourite TV serial last night? Try the new, Yahoo! TV. visit http://in.tv.yahoo.com From tekalp ece.rochester.edu Fri Dec 13 23:58:41 2002 From: tekalp ece.rochester.edu (tekalp@ece.rochester.edu) Date: Wed Jul 30 14:09:23 2003 Subject: [M4IF Technotes] Error resilience -- what does it mean to discard a MB? Message-ID: <4910-220021261445841334@M2W047.mail2web.com> In an IP packetized transport scenario, does RVLC have any role? Isn't IP packets with bit errors discarded anyways? Why do anyone care for RVLC in that case? Murat Original Message: ----------------- From: Gaurav Aggarwal guraaf@yahoo.co.in Date: Fri, 13 Dec 2023 20:10:24 +0530 To: technotes@lists.m4if.org Subject: [M4IF Technotes] Error resilience -- what does it mean to discard a MB? Sorry for being a little naive and not searching through archives closely to understand the issue. My query relates to error resilience tools of MPEG-4 SP/ASP. I am having trouble with the term "discard a macroblock" based on the four stragies desribed in the Annex E of the Visual Spec (part 2). In short, for an I-VOP, the DC coefficients are together and the AC separate. Suppose, the AC coefficients have a problem for a few macroblocks. Now, for the corresponding macroblock, should I display the "DC" uniform 16x16 patch, or should I use the macroblock at the corresponding location in the previous picture? Also, should I use this erroneous macroblock for DC/AC coeff prediction and for motion prediction? I guess, do not use for either. Finally, the Annex E says that for an I-VOP, do not display it if the four strategies say that its fine to use a macroblock. Doesn't this imply that reversible VLCs have NO meaning for an I-VOP, because each macroblock will be intra, and hence no need bothering to decode the AC coefficients in reverse direction because anyway an intra-MB will not be decoded... Would really appreciate if you can point me to some reference implementation or other relevant sources. And BTW, is handling of errors using the 4 strategies "normative" or informative. Do I need to definitely support RVLC in backward direction and Data Partitioning to be truly MPEG-4 SP compliant? Thanks, Gaurav ________________________________________________________________________ Missed your favourite TV serial last night? Try the new, Yahoo! TV. visit http://in.tv.yahoo.com _______________________________________________ Technotes mailing list Technotes@lists.m4if.org http://lists.m4if.org/mailman/listinfo/technotes -------------------------------------------------------------------- mail2web - Check your email from the web at http://mail2web.com/ . From olivier.avaro rd.francetelecom.com Sun Dec 15 19:59:03 2002 From: olivier.avaro rd.francetelecom.com (AVARO Olivier FTRD/DIH/REN) Date: Wed Jul 30 14:09:24 2003 Subject: [M4IF Technotes] video windowing Message-ID: <571B06D35309794BA9204B5A090CC10101A162C8@lanmhs50.rd.francetelecom.fr> I am trying to find out if there is a tool or feature on the MPEG-4 spec that will allow you to set-up a window within the frame area and only decode the area included in the window. For instance imagine looking at the video on a screen, and being able to interactively select a particular area of the video using your mouse, so that only that area is displayed (and of course only the part of the codestream pertaining to such area is actually decompressed). I am trying to find out if there is a specific profile and/or tool that covers this mode of operation. I am not sure if this mode of operation is possible with just decdoding what you see on the screen. I am not sure it is practical either. But what can be done is to decode a frame bigger than what you display and navigate in it. You will need a minimal scene info. for that (BIFS). cu, O. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: /pipermail/mp4-tech/attachments/20021215/04718309/attachment.html From iamgfzhou sina.com Mon Dec 16 10:15:21 2002 From: iamgfzhou sina.com (Zhou guanfeng) Date: Wed Jul 30 14:09:24 2003 Subject: [M4IF Technotes] question on DCT Message-ID: <00d401c2a4a8$fd2693a0$020000c0@zhougf> Hi, I am new to MPEG4.I wonder if DCT transform is applied in MPEG4? thanks. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: /pipermail/mp4-tech/attachments/20021216/342886e0/attachment.html From bhaskar.sherigar broadcom.com Mon Dec 16 10:28:43 2002 From: bhaskar.sherigar broadcom.com (Bhaskar Sherigar) Date: Wed Jul 30 14:09:24 2003 Subject: [M4IF Technotes] question on DCT References: <00d401c2a4a8$fd2693a0$020000c0@zhougf> Message-ID: <3DFD5D83.FC1A672@broadcom.com> Hi, MPEG4 has DCT requirements same as MPEG2, but has more stringent conditions to meet the error statistics. -Bhaskar Zhou guanfeng wrote: > Hi, I am new to MPEG4.I wonder if DCT transform is applied in > MPEG4?thanks. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: /pipermail/mp4-tech/attachments/20021216/bbf17915/attachment.html From lzm02 mails.tsinghua.edu.cn Mon Dec 16 15:20:55 2002 From: lzm02 mails.tsinghua.edu.cn (Li Zhengming) Date: Wed Jul 30 14:09:24 2003 Subject: [M4IF Technotes] How to find a pure video stream? Message-ID: <004601c2a4d3$ac807670$38496fa6@automatihc6u4i> Skipped content of type multipart/alternative-------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/octet-stream Size: 15492 bytes Desc: not available Url : /pipermail/mp4-tech/attachments/20021216/85ff25e1/attachment.exe -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/octet-stream Size: 3781 bytes Desc: not available Url : /pipermail/mp4-tech/attachments/20021216/85ff25e1/attachment-0001.exe From ben interframemedia.com Mon Dec 16 00:32:40 2002 From: ben interframemedia.com (Ben Waggoner) Date: Wed Jul 30 14:09:24 2003 Subject: [M4IF Technotes] HD capable MPEG-4 decoders Message-ID: Folks, I'm looking for what MPEG-4 decoders are capable of handing full-screen 1280x720 resolutions with Simple and/or Advanced Simple content. Ben Waggoner Compressed Video Consulting, Training, and Encoding My Book: http://www.benwaggoner.com/books.htm Cleaner e-book: http://www.cmpbooks.com/cleaner Compression Books: http://www.benwaggoner.com/bookshelf.htm From iamgfzhou sina.com Mon Dec 16 17:48:20 2002 From: iamgfzhou sina.com (Zhou guanfeng) Date: Wed Jul 30 14:09:24 2003 Subject: [M4IF Technotes] Standard test sequence Message-ID: <013501c2a4e8$4503a570$020000c0@zhougf> Folks, Where can I get all the test sequence for MPEG4? thanks. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: /pipermail/mp4-tech/attachments/20021216/80d709bd/attachment.html From egrab divxnetworks.com Mon Dec 16 11:09:55 2002 From: egrab divxnetworks.com (Eric Grab) Date: Wed Jul 30 14:09:24 2003 Subject: [M4IF Technotes] HD capable MPEG-4 decoders Message-ID: <92800BEF04DB704192951C1A407CD91D720503@mrsmith.divxnetworks.com> Ben, DivX Codec 5.x (MPEG-4 ASP) will do HD decoding in real time on a reasonably fast PC. 720p (1280x720) is pretty easy. For 1080p (1920x1080) you need a very fast PC and it depends on your combination of features such as q-pel and post processing. With some testing we have done, using q-pel and deblocking postprocessing gives great results at the higher resolutions. Also the bit rate for 720p is about 4MB, and for 1080 it is about 7MB. -- Eric Grab, Director of Engineering, mailto:egrab@divxnetworks.com phoneto:858.909.5311 -----Original Message----- From: Ben Waggoner [mailto:ben@interframemedia.com] Sent: Monday, December 16, 2023 12:33 AM To: M4if Technotes Subject: [M4IF Technotes] HD capable MPEG-4 decoders Folks, I'm looking for what MPEG-4 decoders are capable of handing full-screen 1280x720 resolutions with Simple and/or Advanced Simple content. Ben Waggoner Compressed Video Consulting, Training, and Encoding My Book: http://www.benwaggoner.com/books.htm Cleaner e-book: http://www.cmpbooks.com/cleaner Compression Books: http://www.benwaggoner.com/bookshelf.htm _______________________________________________ Technotes mailing list Technotes@lists.m4if.org http://lists.m4if.org/mailman/listinfo/technotes From ben interframemedia.com Mon Dec 16 11:35:56 2002 From: ben interframemedia.com (Ben Waggoner) Date: Wed Jul 30 14:09:24 2003 Subject: [M4IF Technotes] HD capable MPEG-4 decoders In-Reply-To: <0ADFC3A378B7B2408351059DCC465DAD023F2F@xchange.sfo.envivio.com> Message-ID: Boris, Yeah? My 2x Athlon MP 2100+ with a GForce 4 4200 card couldn't playback in realtime 1280x720 24p via RealOne. Any performance tips? Ben Waggoner Compressed Video Consulting, Training, and Encoding My Book: http://www.benwaggoner.com/books.htm Cleaner e-book: http://www.cmpbooks.com/cleaner Compression Books: http://www.benwaggoner.com/bookshelf.htm on 12/16/02 11:24, Boris Felts at bfelts@envivio.com wrote: > QuickTime player can handle it (maybe not realtime though...) > EnvivioTV plays 720p contents in realtime (I have not tried yet higher > resolutions) From ben interframemedia.com Mon Dec 16 12:33:27 2002 From: ben interframemedia.com (Ben Waggoner) Date: Wed Jul 30 14:09:24 2003 Subject: [M4IF Technotes] Also, what's going on with HD MPEG-4 Message-ID: Folks, Speaking of HD MPEG-4 (which is almost, but not quite, working for me at full frame rate on several machines), what is going on with proposed formats for doing HD delivery on red-laser DVD? Advanced Simple clearly provides sufficient quality at 1280x720 24p for a two hour movie on a DVD-9. I've getting darn good quality at 6 Mbps with 2-pass VBR out of Squeeze. So, what's happening with actually making some products based around that? Is ASP going to be skipped for H.264? Is BIFS going to be used for interactivity (menus and such)? Is this all far, too far out to even discuss right now? Ben Waggoner Compressed Video Consulting, Training, and Encoding My Book: http://www.benwaggoner.com/books.htm Cleaner e-book: http://www.cmpbooks.com/cleaner Compression Books: http://www.benwaggoner.com/bookshelf.htm From bfelts envivio.com Mon Dec 16 11:24:40 2002 From: bfelts envivio.com (Boris Felts) Date: Wed Jul 30 14:09:24 2003 Subject: [M4IF Technotes] HD capable MPEG-4 decoders Message-ID: <0ADFC3A378B7B2408351059DCC465DAD023F2F@xchange.sfo.envivio.com> QuickTime player can handle it (maybe not realtime though...) EnvivioTV plays 720p contents in realtime (I have not tried yet higher resolutions) Boris Envivio. > -----Original Message----- > From: Ben Waggoner [mailto:ben@interframemedia.com] > Sent: Monday, December 16, 2023 12:33 AM > To: M4if Technotes > Subject: [M4IF Technotes] HD capable MPEG-4 decoders > > > Folks, > > I'm looking for what MPEG-4 decoders are capable of > handing full-screen 1280x720 resolutions with Simple and/or > Advanced Simple content. > > Ben Waggoner > Compressed Video Consulting, Training, and Encoding > > My Book: http://www.benwaggoner.com/books.htm > Cleaner e-book: http://www.cmpbooks.com/cleaner > Compression Books: http://www.benwaggoner.com/bookshelf.htm > > > > _______________________________________________ > Technotes mailing list > Technotes@lists.m4if.org > http://lists.m4if.org/mailman/listinfo/technot> es > From bfelts envivio.com Mon Dec 16 12:07:29 2002 From: bfelts envivio.com (Boris Felts) Date: Wed Jul 30 14:09:24 2003 Subject: [M4IF Technotes] HD capable MPEG-4 decoders Message-ID: <0ADFC3A378B7B2408351059DCC465DAD023F36@xchange.sfo.envivio.com> You can set "UseDirectdraw overlay if available" in EnvivioTV options. A 720p content is played back on my laptop (Pentium 4 ~ 1.5GHz) Is your CPU maxed out? (you can maybe reply on our forum or to me privately, to avoid the propogation of non-MPEG-4 related emails on the reflector) Thanks, Boris > -----Original Message----- > From: Ben Waggoner [mailto:ben@interframemedia.com] > Sent: Monday, December 16, 2023 11:36 AM > To: Boris Felts; M4if Technotes > Subject: Re: [M4IF Technotes] HD capable MPEG-4 decoders > > > Boris, > > Yeah? My 2x Athlon MP 2100+ with a GForce 4 4200 card > couldn't playback in realtime 1280x720 24p via RealOne. Any > performance tips? > > Ben Waggoner > Compressed Video Consulting, Training, and Encoding > > My Book: http://www.benwaggoner.com/books.htm > Cleaner e-book: http://www.cmpbooks.com/cleaner > Compression Books: http://www.benwaggoner.com/bookshelf.htm > > > > > on 12/16/02 11:24, Boris Felts at bfelts@envivio.com wrote: > > > QuickTime player can handle it (maybe not realtime though...) > > EnvivioTV plays 720p contents in realtime (I have not tried > yet higher > > resolutions) > > > From rob.koenen m4if.org Mon Dec 16 17:54:53 2002 From: rob.koenen m4if.org (Rob Koenen) Date: Wed Jul 30 14:09:25 2003 Subject: [M4IF Technotes] question on DCT In-Reply-To: <00d401c2a4a8$fd2693a0$020000c0@zhougf> Message-ID: <000a01c2a56f$4f9da6c0$ad34fea9@rkoenent21> yes. -----Original Message----- From: technotes-admin@lists.m4if.org [mailto:technotes-admin@lists.m4if.org] On Behalf Of Zhou guanfeng Sent: Sunday, December 15, 2023 6:15 PM To: MPEG-4 ?????? Subject: [M4IF Technotes] question on DCT Hi, I am new to MPEG4.I wonder if DCT transform is applied in MPEG4? thanks. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: /pipermail/mp4-tech/attachments/20021216/25a47c88/attachment.html From d98rolb stud.hh.se Tue Dec 17 12:24:59 2002 From: d98rolb stud.hh.se (Roland Bengtsson) Date: Wed Jul 30 14:09:25 2003 Subject: [M4IF Technotes] How is FGS used? Message-ID: <4.3.1.0.20021217121829.00bca100@studpop.hh.se> I wonder how the FGS profile is used? I have read about the profile and how the enhancement layer is divided in several bitplanes so the client can choose how much it will use depending on available resources. But what is included in these resources? CPU-power? Yes this seems to logical if the client don't have the power to show all the bitplanes it can show only some basic video stream. Bandwidth on network? I don't see how FGS can be used here because if the server send all the bitplanes to the server it may already use too much of the bandwidth... The videostream must be cut on the server to minimize the use of the network. Or have I missed something important here? Regards Roland From sps iis.fhg.de Tue Dec 17 17:38:31 2002 From: sps iis.fhg.de (Ralph Sperschneider) Date: Wed Jul 30 14:09:25 2003 Subject: [M4IF Technotes] Standard test sequence In-Reply-To: <013501c2a4e8$4503a570$020000c0@zhougf> References: <013501c2a4e8$4503a570$020000c0@zhougf> Message-ID: <3DFF5307.9000607@iis.fhg.de> Zhou guanfeng wrote: > Folks, > Where can I get all the test sequence for MPEG4? > thanks. Hi, the second edition on MPEG-4 Conformance (14496-4:2003) will be issued soon. It will be accompanied with all conformance test sequences that are defined by MPEG and are currently available. Best gegards, Ralph -- Dipl.-Ing. Ralph Sperschneider | Phone: +49 9131 776 344 FhG IIS-A | Fax: +49 9131 776 398 Am Wolfsmantel 33 | mailto:sps@iis.fhg.de D 91058 Erlangen | http://www.iis.fhg.de/amm/ From vharisha ftdpl.com Wed Dec 18 14:27:38 2002 From: vharisha ftdpl.com (harisha V) Date: Wed Jul 30 14:09:25 2003 Subject: [M4IF Technotes] Mpeg-4 audio/video quality measurement Message-ID: Hi all Can any one tell how much decoded MPEG-4 audio/video data should be deviated from Reference decoded sequences. How the difference is measured when decoded file compared with reference file. Is there any Tool measure such difference Harisha *******This e-mail may contain confidential, privileged and / or information exempt from disclosure under applicable law. If you are not the intended recipient or have received this e-mail in error, please notify to mailadmin@ftdpl.com immediately and destroy this e-mail. Any unauthorised copying, disclosure or distribution of the material in this e-mail is strictly forbidden****** From bhaskar.sherigar broadcom.com Wed Dec 18 16:07:17 2002 From: bhaskar.sherigar broadcom.com (Bhaskar Sherigar) Date: Wed Jul 30 14:09:25 2003 Subject: [M4IF Technotes] Mpeg-4 audio/video quality measurement References: Message-ID: <3E004FDD.12EA6096@broadcom.com> Hi, The video data that can be deviated from the Reference data and all other error percentages are mentioned in IEEE-1180 Standard Specification. This is basically for MPEG2, in addition to this following needs to be met. The N by N inverse discrete transform shall conform to IEEE Standard Specification for the Implementations of 8 by 8 Inverse Discrete Cosine Transform, Std 1180-1990, December 6, 1990, with the following modifications: 1) In item (1) of subclause 3.2 of the IEEE specification, the last sentence is replaced by: <> 2) The text of subclause 3.3 of the IEEE specification is replaced by : <> 3) Let F be the set of 4096 blocks Bi[y][x] (i=0..4095) defined as follows : a) Bi[0][0] = i - 2048 b) Bi[7][7] = 1 if Bi[0][0] is even, Bi[7][7] = 0 if Bi[0][0] is odd c) All other coefficients Bi[y][x] other than Bi[0][0] and Bi[7][7] are equal to 0 For each block Bi[y][x] that belongs to set F defined above, an IDCT that claims to be compliant shall output a block f[y][x] that as a peak error of 1 or less compared to the reference saturated mathematical integer-number IDCT f??(x,y). In other words, | f[y][x] - f??(x,y)| shall be <= 1 for all x and y.?ISO/IEC 14496-2:2001(E) NOTE 1 lause 2.3 Std 1180-1990 ?Considerations of Specifying IDCT Mismatch Errors? requires the specification of periodic intra-picture coding in order to control the accumulation of mismatch errors. Every macroblock is required to be refreshed before it is coded 132 times as predictive macroblocks. Macroblocks in B-pictures (and skipped macroblocks in P-pictures) are excluded from the counting because they do not lead to the accumulation of mismatch errors. This requirement is the same as indicated in 1180-1990 for visual telephony according to ITU-T Recommendation H.261. NOTE 2 Whilst the IEEE IDCT standard mentioned above is a necessary condition for the satisfactory implementation of the IDCT function it should be understood that this is not sufficient. In particular attention is drawn to the following sentence from subclause 5.4: ?Where arithmetic precision is not specified, such as the calculation of the IDCT, the precision shall be sufficient so that significant errors do not occur in the final integer values.? -Bhaskar harisha V wrote: > Hi all > > Can any one tell how much decoded MPEG-4 audio/video data should be > deviated from Reference decoded sequences. > > How the difference is measured when decoded file compared with reference > file. > Is there any Tool measure such difference > > Harisha > > *******This e-mail may contain confidential, privileged and / or information > exempt from disclosure under applicable law. If you are not the intended > recipient or have received this e-mail in error, please notify to > mailadmin@ftdpl.com immediately and destroy this e-mail. Any unauthorised > copying, disclosure or distribution of the material in this e-mail is > strictly forbidden****** > > _______________________________________________ > Technotes mailing list > Technotes@lists.m4if.org > http://lists.m4if.org/mailman/listinfo/technotes From yrenjie sina.com Thu Dec 19 20:42:14 2002 From: yrenjie sina.com (Yu Renjie) Date: Wed Jul 30 14:09:25 2003 Subject: [M4IF Technotes] about "AIR" for error resilience Message-ID: <200212191432.gBJEWAbj029691@mx3.magma.ca> Dear all: In 14496-2:1999/Amd.1:2000,it is said "the number of intra MBs in a VOP is fixed and pre-determined."but how to pre-determined? Regards From nico.oorts xmt.be Thu Dec 19 16:54:34 2002 From: nico.oorts xmt.be (Nico Oorts) Date: Wed Jul 30 14:09:25 2003 Subject: [M4IF Technotes] Problem in BIFS description Message-ID: <3E01EBBA.3070300@xmt.be> Hi, I have a scene description containing a scene with different audiotracks. I describe one audiosource (pointing to an OD) and do a replace commando after some time with another audiosource. This is repeated for some other tracks. When I compile the BIFStext with mp4tool and I play the result than the updates are played correctly (at the correct time). The only problem is that all tracks are internally playing from timestamp 0. I thought this was related with the UPDATE commando for the OD, which is executed at timestamp 0. I already changed this but without result. Some ideas? Best Regards, Nico Oorts Here are the BIFS: Layer2D { children [ Sound2D { source DEF N0 AudioSource { url [ "3" ] } } ] } InitialObjectDescriptor { objectDescriptorID 1 ODProfileLevelIndication 254 sceneProfileLevelIndication 254 audioProfileLevelIndication 254 visualProfileLevelIndication 254 graphicsProfileLevelIndication 254 includeInlineProfileLevelFlag true esdescr [ ES_Descriptor { es_id 2 streamPriority 0 decConfigDescr DecoderConfigDescriptor { objectTypeIndication 1 streamType 3 upStream false bufferSizeDB 75 maxBitrate 0 avgBitrate 0 decSpecificInfo BIFSConfig { isCommandStream true pixelMetrics true pixelWidth 0 pixelHeight 0 nodeIDBits 10 routeIDBits 10 } } slConfigDescr SLConfigDescriptor { } } ES_Descriptor { es_id 1 streamPriority 0 decConfigDescr DecoderConfigDescriptor { objectTypeIndication 255 streamType 1 upStream false bufferSizeDB 84 maxBitrate 0 avgBitrate 0 } slConfigDescr SLConfigDescriptor { } } ] } AT 0 { UPDATE OD [ ObjectDescriptor { objectDescriptorID 3 esdescr [ ES_Descriptor { es_id 3 streamPriority 16 decConfigDescr DecoderConfigDescriptor { objectTypeIndication 193 streamType 5 upStream false bufferSizeDB 20 maxBitrate 0 avgBitrate 0 } slConfigDescr SLConfigDescriptor { } muxInfo muxInfo { fileName "voetbal_hugo_pcm.media" } } ] } ObjectDescriptor { objectDescriptorID 5 esdescr [ ES_Descriptor { es_id 5 streamPriority 16 decConfigDescr DecoderConfigDescriptor { objectTypeIndication 193 streamType 5 upStream false bufferSizeDB 20 maxBitrate 0 avgBitrate 0 } slConfigDescr SLConfigDescriptor { } muxInfo muxInfo { fileName "voetbal_voetbalA_pcm.media" } } ] } ObjectDescriptor { objectDescriptorID 6 esdescr [ ES_Descriptor { es_id 6 streamPriority 16 decConfigDescr DecoderConfigDescriptor { objectTypeIndication 193 streamType 5 upStream false bufferSizeDB 20 maxBitrate 0 avgBitrate 0 } slConfigDescr SLConfigDescriptor { } muxInfo muxInfo { fileName "voetbal_glen_pcm.media" } } ] } ObjectDescriptor { objectDescriptorID 7 esdescr [ ES_Descriptor { es_id 7 streamPriority 16 decConfigDescr DecoderConfigDescriptor { objectTypeIndication 193 streamType 5 upStream false bufferSizeDB 20 maxBitrate 0 avgBitrate 0 } slConfigDescr SLConfigDescriptor { } muxInfo muxInfo { fileName "voetbal_voetbalB_pcm.media" } } ] } ObjectDescriptor { objectDescriptorID 8 esdescr [ ES_Descriptor { es_id 8 streamPriority 16 decConfigDescr DecoderConfigDescriptor { objectTypeIndication 193 streamType 5 upStream false bufferSizeDB 20 maxBitrate 0 avgBitrate 0 } slConfigDescr SLConfigDescriptor { } muxInfo muxInfo { fileName "voetbal_hugo_pcm.media" } } ] } ObjectDescriptor { objectDescriptorID 9 esdescr [ ES_Descriptor { es_id 9 streamPriority 16 decConfigDescr DecoderConfigDescriptor { objectTypeIndication 193 streamType 5 upStream false bufferSizeDB 20 maxBitrate 0 avgBitrate 0 } slConfigDescr SLConfigDescriptor { } muxInfo muxInfo { fileName "voetbal_voetbalC_pcm.media" } } ] } ] # end UPDATE OD } AT 15000{ REPLACE N0 BY DEF N1 AudioSource { url [5] } } AT 30000{ REPLACE N1 BY DEF N2 AudioSource { url [6] } } AT 45000{ REPLACE N2 BY DEF N3 AudioSource { url [7] } } AT 60000{ REPLACE N3 BY DEF N4 AudioSource { url [8] } } AT 75000{ REPLACE N4 BY DEF N5 AudioSource { url [8] } } AT 90000{ DELETE N5 } From vharisha ftdpl.com Fri Dec 20 14:09:55 2002 From: vharisha ftdpl.com (harisha V) Date: Wed Jul 30 14:09:25 2003 Subject: [M4IF Technotes] ISOMP4LIb Message-ID: Hi all Can You tell me where can I get Source code of ISOMP4Lib that has been used MPEG-4 Audio Thanks Harisha *******This e-mail may contain confidential, privileged and / or information exempt from disclosure under applicable law. If you are not the intended recipient or have received this e-mail in error, please notify to mailadmin@ftdpl.com immediately and destroy this e-mail. Any unauthorised copying, disclosure or distribution of the material in this e-mail is strictly forbidden****** From alisson dsc.ufcg.edu.br Fri Dec 20 11:10:16 2002 From: alisson dsc.ufcg.edu.br (Alisson Vasconcelos de Brito / Pos. COPIN) Date: Wed Jul 30 14:09:25 2003 Subject: [M4IF Technotes] Mp4 decoder Message-ID: Hi all, Anybody knows any decent app that converts mp4 files to avi? Thanks, Alisson From julien resonate-mp4.com Mon Dec 23 10:33:09 2002 From: julien resonate-mp4.com (Julien Boeuf) Date: Wed Jul 30 14:09:25 2003 Subject: [M4IF Technotes] ISOMP4LIb References: Message-ID: <004f01c2aa66$4ebcb010$0500a8c0@herreweghe> Hi, If you're talking about the lib you can use to read/write in MP4 files, you can get it at ftp://index.apple.com. Note that the access is restricted to MPEG/JPEG members. Regards, Julien. ----- Original Message ----- From: "harisha V" To: Sent: Friday, December 20, 2023 2:09 PM Subject: [M4IF Technotes] ISOMP4LIb | | Hi all | | Can You tell me where can I get Source code of ISOMP4Lib that has been used | MPEG-4 Audio | | Thanks | Harisha | | | *******This e-mail may contain confidential, privileged and / or information | exempt from disclosure under applicable law. If you are not the intended | recipient or have received this e-mail in error, please notify to | mailadmin@ftdpl.com immediately and destroy this e-mail. Any unauthorised | copying, disclosure or distribution of the material in this e-mail is | strictly forbidden****** | | _______________________________________________ | Technotes mailing list | Technotes@lists.m4if.org | http://lists.m4if.org/mailman/listinfo/technotes | From alisson dsc.ufcg.edu.br Mon Dec 23 10:50:47 2002 From: alisson dsc.ufcg.edu.br (Alisson Vasconcelos de Brito / Pos. COPIN) Date: Wed Jul 30 14:09:25 2003 Subject: [M4IF Technotes] Mp4 files compatibility In-Reply-To: <004f01c2aa66$4ebcb010$0500a8c0@herreweghe> Message-ID: Hi, Anybody knows why .mp4 files created by xvidenc and mp4creator doesnt work on QuickTime 6, but works on all others decoders? Is there any configurations I should make? Thanks, Alisson From menno punkass.com Mon Dec 23 15:43:45 2002 From: menno punkass.com (menno) Date: Wed Jul 30 14:09:25 2003 Subject: [M4IF Technotes] 14496-3:2001 Corrigendum 2002 Message-ID: Hello, Can anyone clarify why the "emphasis" field has been removed from the ADTS specification in 14496-3? This makes it impossible to decode older ADTS files that comply with the standard before Corrigendum 2002. (and I'm not looking for this answer: "Because then it is the same as in 13818-7 (MPEG-2 AAC)") Menno From wmay cisco.com Mon Dec 23 09:57:27 2002 From: wmay cisco.com (Bill May) Date: Wed Jul 30 14:09:25 2003 Subject: [M4IF Technotes] Mp4 files compatibility References: Message-ID: <3E074E87.5000303@cisco.com> xvidenc does not correctly add a VOSH header, which has the profile information. mp4creator then defaults it to the highest profile level. QT 6.0 checks for that profile information, and won't play the profile information. mpeg4ip 0.9.7 version will display warning messages telling which headers are missing. In CVS on sourceforge, I have added an override command for the profile which will become part of the 0.9.8 release of mpeg4ip; however, the real fix would be to get XVID to add the correct VOSH header. Bill May mpeg4ip Alisson Vasconcelos de Brito / Pos. COPIN wrote: > Hi, > Anybody knows why .mp4 files created by xvidenc and mp4creator > doesnt work on QuickTime 6, but works on all others decoders? Is there any > configurations I should make? > Thanks, > Alisson > > _______________________________________________ > Technotes mailing list > Technotes@lists.m4if.org > http://lists.m4if.org/mailman/listinfo/technotes > From CC_Ju mtk.com.tw Mon Dec 30 14:04:52 2002 From: CC_Ju mtk.com.tw (CC_Ju@mtk.com.tw) Date: Wed Jul 30 14:09:25 2003 Subject: [M4IF Technotes] Where to get 14496-4 version2 test bitstream?? Message-ID: Hi, all: The available ISO 14496-4 CDROM version in ISO web site contains only MPEG4 version1 test bitstream. Anybody can tell me where to buy or to get the associated test bitstreams of MPEG4 version2. We appreciate your sincere help. Thanks in advance !!!!! Peter From jean-claude.dufourd enst.fr Mon Dec 30 08:53:33 2002 From: jean-claude.dufourd enst.fr (Jean-Claude Dufourd) Date: Wed Jul 30 14:09:25 2003 Subject: [M4IF Technotes] Where to get 14496-4 version2 test bitstream?? References: Message-ID: <3E0FFB7D.8040209@enst.fr> The second edition of conformance is in the care of ITTF (last stage before publication). So it will be available real soon now. Best regards JC CC_Ju@mtk.com.tw wrote: > The available ISO 14496-4 CDROM version in ISO web site contains only >MPEG4 version1 test bitstream. Anybody can tell me where to buy or to get >the associated test bitstreams of MPEG4 version2. We appreciate your >sincere help. > > From sps iis.fhg.de Mon Dec 30 14:43:30 2002 From: sps iis.fhg.de (Ralph Sperschneider) Date: Wed Jul 30 14:09:25 2003 Subject: [M4IF Technotes] Error resiliency test tools In-Reply-To: <009401c29b12$13ba0570$bea49780@h414pc5> References: <009401c29b12$13ba0570$bea49780@h414pc5> Message-ID: <3E104D82.1050402@iis.fhg.de> Oztan Harmanci wrote: > Hi. I have a couple of questions about error resiliency simulations. Any > help is greatly appreciated. > > It appears that the roots of the error resiliency tests in the VM go > back to N0999 -'95 Tokyo paper. According to the test results -for > example- resync marker spacing is advised under different channel > conditions and bit rates. Channel is simulated using a "NTT DoCoMo" > originated software, and if I didnt understand wrong it uses a two state > markov model to simulate the bit errors. > > Does anyone know where I can find this "NTT DoCoMo" software Oztan, this software is part of the MPEG-4 reference software. Just check out 14496-5.2001/audio/natural/errGen/gilbert.c in http://www.iso.ch/iso/en/ittf/PubliclyAvailableStandards/ISO_IEC_14496-5_2001_Software_Reference/audio.zip Best regards, Ralph > and whether > this software is applicable to 3GPP1/2 network > simulations(cdma2000/wcdma type networks)? > > There is a similar channel simulation testing software for JVT, namely > VCEG-N37. The problem with N37 is that it does not allow any > errored packets to be passed to upper levels. In other words, bit errors > are not allowed. This confuses me: Assuming that N37 software is a valid > 3G simulation tool, and that N37 can be changed to simulate MPEG4 > transmissions, what is the point of having bit error resiliency if there > wont be any? Does that mean MPEG4's bit based error resiliency tools > are not needed in 3G networks? This means RVLC and data partitioning > become useless! Am I missing something here? > > Thanks > Oztan -- Dipl.-Ing. Ralph Sperschneider | Phone: +49 9131 776 344 FhG IIS-A | Fax: +49 9131 776 398 Am Wolfsmantel 33 | mailto:sps@iis.fhg.de D 91058 Erlangen | http://www.iis.fhg.de/amm/ From sps iis.fhg.de Mon Dec 30 14:52:30 2002 From: sps iis.fhg.de (Ralph Sperschneider) Date: Wed Jul 30 14:09:26 2003 Subject: [M4IF Technotes] Re: 14496-3:2001 Corrigendum 2002 In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <3E104F9E.3080903@iis.fhg.de> menno wrote: > Hello, > > Can anyone clarify why the "emphasis" field has been removed from the ADTS > specification in 14496-3? This makes it impossible to decode older ADTS files > that comply with the standard before Corrigendum 2002. > > (and I'm not looking for this answer: "Because then it is the same as in > 13818-7 (MPEG-2 AAC)") Dear Menno, the emphasis field found it?s way into the MPEG-4 ADTS specification by failure. Most likely, it was removed from the MPEG-2 AAC specification after MPEG-4 was branched (about 1996/97), and the MPEG-4 editors missed to remove it as well. This has now been fixed by the mentioned corrigendum. Best regards, Ralph -- Dipl.-Ing. Ralph Sperschneider | Phone: +49 9131 776 344 FhG IIS-A | Fax: +49 9131 776 398 Am Wolfsmantel 33 | mailto:sps@iis.fhg.de D 91058 Erlangen | http://www.iis.fhg.de/amm/ From menno punkass.com Mon Dec 30 15:44:33 2002 From: menno punkass.com (menno) Date: Wed Jul 30 14:09:26 2003 Subject: [M4IF Technotes] Re: 14496-3:2001 Corrigendum 2002 In-Reply-To: <3E104F9E.3080903@iis.fhg.de> Message-ID: Hi, > > Can anyone clarify why the "emphasis" field has been removed from the ADTS > > specification in 14496-3? This makes it impossible to decode > older ADTS files > > that comply with the standard before Corrigendum 2002. > > > > (and I'm not looking for this answer: "Because then it is the same as in > > 13818-7 (MPEG-2 AAC)") > > the emphasis field found it?s way into the MPEG-4 ADTS > specification by failure. > Most likely, it was removed from the MPEG-2 AAC specification after > MPEG-4 was > branched (about 1996/97), and the MPEG-4 editors missed to remove > it as well. > This has now been fixed by the mentioned corrigendum. If that's what you call fixed. I think it's more broken now. How about the existing implementations? Isn't it better to just leave this mistake in than to break even more, after it has been in the standard for a few years already? Menno From lzm02 mails.tsinghua.edu.cn Sun Dec 29 15:49:44 2002 From: lzm02 mails.tsinghua.edu.cn (Li Zhengming) Date: Wed Jul 30 14:09:26 2003 Subject: [M4IF Technotes] Where can I find a Mpeg4 Encoder? 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