From singer  apple.com  Fri Sep  1 09:49:13 2006
From: singer  apple.com (Dave Singer)
Date: Fri Sep  1 03:04:09 2006
Subject: [Mp4-tech] MP4 data clarification for atoms
In-Reply-To: <007b01c6cd31$abfcf090$55000a0a@adamgx620>
References: <007b01c6cd31$abfcf090$55000a0a@adamgx620>
Message-ID: <p062309bdc11d8794499b@[17.202.35.52]>
At 12:14  -0700 31/08/06, Adam Potolsky wrote:
>First let me say thank you to everyone who 
>responded to my first post. Your responses have 
>been very helpful. Based on that, I want to make 
>a few statement and ask a question or 2 for 
>clarification to make sure I'm understanding 
>this properly.
>
>1) Based on what I've read, is it correct to say 
>that w/o some kind of header data (wrapper?) 
>around the actual mpeg4 encoded media content, 
>that content is useless. That is to say it's not 
>possible (or effectively useless) to try and 
>play the content. Further, it would be 
>impossible to gather a correct bitrate, height, 
>width, etc? from here because that information 
>is necessary to even know how to decode the 
>content.
>
I'm not sure what level you are wrapping, but 
yes, you need to know what decoders, what 
parameters to those decoders, width, height, 
timing, sampling rates, and so on.
>2) For any given file, there are conceptually 4 
>states of 32/64 bit implementation. Although the 
>standard strongly recommends not using 64bit for 
>anything that doesn't need it, it's not 
>forbidden. So, for example, there could be a 
>17GB mpeg movie with some "size-type-content" 
>boxes that are 32bit, while at least one must be 
>64bit. Something like:
>
>0000 0020 6674 7970 XXXX XXXX XXXX XXXX XXXX XXXX <ftyp> (32-bit)
><A moov atom>
>0000 0078 6d76 6864 0000 0001 <120 bytes, mvhd, 
>version = 1 (32-bit size with 64bit content)
>XXXX XXXX XXXX XXXX <create time>
>XXXX XXXX XXXX XXXX <mod time>
>XXXX XXXX <timescale>
>XXXX XXXX XXXX XXXX <duration>
>XXXX XXXX XXXX XXXX <etc?>
>XXXX XXXX XXXX XXXX
>XXXX XXXX
>XXXX XXXX
>XXXX XXXX XXXX XXXX (twice)
>XXXX XXXX XXXX XXXX (9 times)
>XXXX XXXX XXXX XXXX (6 times)
>XXXX XXXX XXXX XXXX
><More atoms>
>0000 0001 6d64 6174 0000 0003 fff9 1a4b <64-bit 
>size, mdat, 17179417163 byte size> (64-bit size)
><Lots and lots of mdat content>
>
>This is hand built so excuse any little 
>technical stuff, but I tried to make a 
>combination 32/64 file with a 32/64 atom in it.
This looks reasonable.  As you say, you ought to be able to handle
64-bit durations
64-bit timestamps, if you want your software to work after 2040
64-bit atom sizes
64-bit chunk offsets
>
>3) In looking over the atom portion of the spec, 
>it appears that there is no "biggest 
>height/width" field that covers the entire file. 
>It looks like the highest exposure is the 'tkhd' 
>atom. Even still, this is the "recommended 
>presentation" size, not an actual recorded size. 
>So if there is more than one track in an mp4, 
>wouldn't I need to look at them all and pick the 
>"biggest" (height * width?) to report a size?
right, you have to determine the bounding box of 
all the tracks, unless there is a composition 
system like laser or bifs which 'captures' the 
other tracks and defines the composition.
>
>4) Bitrate still eludes me. I have a movie file, 
>assume an MP4 file for now, and I want to find 
>the bitrate (or calculate it.) The file has a 
>H264 component, and a AAC component, so this is 
>already a bit confusing since they certainly 
>have different bitrates. (?don't they?)  I will 
>further assume I can use the video bitrate as 
>the 'file' bitrate when it's opened.
a crude calculation is to take sum(sample size 
table)/track-duration for each track, and sum 
those.  this is a long-term average.  the mpeg4 
bitrate atom or an elementary stream descriptor 
can have more precise information given by the 
content author.
the way the various tracks' bitrates might 'play 
off' against each other is not covered.
>
>Thank you all very much for the continued assistance you provide,
>
>Adam Potolsky
>
>_______________________________________________
>NOTE: Please use clear subject lines for your 
>posts. Include [audio, [video], [systems], 
>[general] or another apppropriate identifier to 
>indicate the type of question you have.
>
>Note: Conduct on the mailing list is subject to 
>the Antitrust guidelines found at 
>http://www.mpegif.org/public/documents/vault/mp-out-30042-Antitrust.php
-- 
David Singer
Apple Computer/QuickTime
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From dsn2603  rediffmail.com  Fri Sep  1 07:27:33 2006
From: dsn2603  rediffmail.com (sakthi  narayanan)
Date: Fri Sep  1 08:51:17 2006
Subject: [Mp4-tech] Mpeg2 aac sbr
Message-ID: <1157044698.S.5202.23958.webmail16.rediffmail.com.1157091892.19109@webmail.rediffmail.com>
Hi experts,&nbsp; Currently,iam working on MPEG2 AAC Decoder.Iam going to&nbsp;incorporate the SBR tool in the mpeg2 aac decoder.I jus want to know the details abt the FILL Element parsing&nbsp;in the decoder side.Can u give me the link for downloading&nbsp;the mpeg2 aac sbr bitstreams&nbsp;n the&nbsp;net.With Regards,sakthi&nbsp;\"Christoph Spranger\" wroteDear Sir or Madam,At the moment Im doing a project over MPEG4 for my university. At the moment, i try to find a way to separate the different pictures by I, P and B-Pictures. I read somewhere that the information about the type of the picture can be found in the picture header. This picture header can probably be found somewhere in the MPEG4 Standard 14496.My problem is, that i dont know exactly, in which part of the standard this information could be found, and I cant afford to buy all parts ;-)I think it has to be part 1 but im not absolutely sure. Perhaps someone can give a hint to a \"poor student\".regards,Christoph Spranger
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From videogenie  hotmail.com  Fri Sep  1 02:49:37 2006
From: videogenie  hotmail.com (The Video Genie)
Date: Fri Sep  1 08:51:24 2006
Subject: [Mp4-tech] Picture Header
In-Reply-To: <bf98976d0608310900s2e08cf49v4b7fd68abaf30069@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <BAY21-F28EB929D5A48DD60AB869DE3C0@phx.gbl>
You may find over the internet two reference implementations of MPEG4 one is 
called MOMUSYS and other is from microsoft. You can also get it from 
mpeg4ip.net guess its in divx or xvid wrapper. The picture is called 
rectangular vop in mpeg4. The type information is placed in vop header. You 
need not any documentation to get a concept. You can develop it in a better 
way by going through reference implemenatations. In divx and Mpeg4 this 
information is same.
All the best
The Video Genie
From: "Christoph Spranger" <christoph.spranger@googlemail.com>
To: mp4-tech@lists.mpegif.org
Subject: [Mp4-tech] Picture Header
Date: Thu, 31 Aug 2023 18:00:36 +0200
Dear Sir or Madam,
At the moment Im doing a project over MPEG4 for my university. At the
moment, i try to find a way to separate the different pictures by I, P and
B-Pictures. I read somewhere that the information about the type of the
picture can be found in the picture header. This picture header can probably
be found somewhere in the MPEG4 Standard 14496.
My problem is, that i dont know exactly, in which part of the standard this
information could be found, and I cant afford to buy all parts ;-)
I think it has to be part 1 but im not absolutely sure. Perhaps someone can
give a hint to a "poor student".
regards,
Christoph Spranger
_______________________________________________
NOTE: Please use clear subject lines for your posts. Include [audio, 
[video], [systems], [general] or another apppropriate identifier to indicate 
the type of question you have.
Note: Conduct on the mailing list is subject to the Antitrust guidelines 
found at 
http://www.mpegif.org/public/documents/vault/mp-out-30042-Antitrust.php
_________________________________________________________________
All-in-one security and maintenance for your PC.  Get a free 90-day trial!   
http://www.windowsonecare.com/trial.aspx?sc_cid=msn_hotmail
From yzheng_jd  yahoo.com.cn  Fri Sep  1 16:37:31 2006
From: yzheng_jd  yahoo.com.cn (Yan Zheng)
Date: Fri Sep  1 08:51:32 2006
Subject: [Mp4-tech] about the parsing process of macroblock_layer( ) in
	H.264 decoding standart JVT_G050 
Message-ID: <20060901073731.75745.qmail@web15106.mail.cnb.yahoo.com>
hello,
  We find out that when decoding a macroblock of Intra_16x16(we use the entropy encode/decode of CABAC), the process as following is unimaginable skipped:
  if(CodedBlockPatternLuma>0 || CodedBlockPatternChroma>0 || MbPartPredMode(mb_type,0)==Intra_16x16){
  mb_qp_delta               se(v)|ae(v)
  }
  That means the SE of mb_qp_delta is not obtained by decoding the bitstream.Then how JM  gets the SE value?is this SE value obtained through other methods? (if so, how the standard be the standard?)
  Thank you all.
---------------------------------
抢注雅虎免费邮箱-3.5G容量，20M附件！ 
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From mahalakshmi.m  jasmin-infotech.com  Fri Sep  1 18:32:04 2006
From: mahalakshmi.m  jasmin-infotech.com (mahalakshmi.m)
Date: Fri Sep  1 08:51:43 2006
Subject: [Mp4-tech] 3gp
Message-ID: <BBEHLGBMFPKOCBPMPFBEOEHMCCAA.mahalakshmi.m@jasmin-infotech.com>
Hai everybody
Can any one know wheather decoder specific information is mandatory for
H.263
Regards,
Mahalakshmi.M
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From singer  apple.com  Fri Sep  1 16:49:04 2006
From: singer  apple.com (Dave Singer)
Date: Fri Sep  1 10:04:08 2006
Subject: [Mp4-tech] 3gp
In-Reply-To: <BBEHLGBMFPKOCBPMPFBEOEHMCCAA.mahalakshmi.m@jasmin-infotech.com>
References: <BBEHLGBMFPKOCBPMPFBEOEHMCCAA.mahalakshmi.m@jasmin-infotech.com>
Message-ID: <p062309d2c11de8b7ef0b@[17.202.35.52]>
At 17:32  +0530 1/09/06, mahalakshmi.m wrote:
>Hai everybody
>Can any one know wheather decoder specific information is mandatory for H.263
'decoder specific information' is an mpeg-4 term and structure.  but 
your question is so brief it's hard to know what you want to know.
But if you get 26.244 from <http://www.3gpp.org/specs/numbering.htm>, 
you will see what 3GPP requires in the sample entry.
-- 
David Singer
Apple Computer/QuickTime
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From singer  apple.com  Fri Sep  1 16:52:56 2006
From: singer  apple.com (Dave Singer)
Date: Fri Sep  1 10:04:17 2006
Subject: [Mp4-tech] Picture Header
In-Reply-To: <BAY21-F28EB929D5A48DD60AB869DE3C0@phx.gbl>
References: <BAY21-F28EB929D5A48DD60AB869DE3C0@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <p062309d3c11deaeb735d@[17.202.35.52]>
At 1:49  -0700 1/09/06, The Video Genie wrote:
>You may find over the internet two reference implementations of 
>MPEG4 one is called MOMUSYS and other is from microsoft. You can 
>also get it from mpeg4ip.net guess its in divx or xvid wrapper. The 
>picture is called rectangular vop in mpeg4. The type information is 
>placed in vop header. You need not any documentation to get a 
>concept. You can develop it in a better way by going through 
>reference implemenatations. In divx and Mpeg4 this information is 
>same.
>All the best
>The Video Genie
Software, of course, will help.
But answering the question, the spec you want would not be 14496-1 
(Systems) but 14496-2 (Visual).  If you buy it, the latest integrated 
spec. would be entirely adequate to answer this question.  I believe 
that this is 14496-2:2004, available for 364 swiss francs from 
www.iso.ch.
I am sure that a free resource should exist to answer this level of 
detail of the visual bitstream syntax, however.
>
>From: "Christoph Spranger" <christoph.spranger@googlemail.com>
>To: mp4-tech@lists.mpegif.org
>Subject: [Mp4-tech] Picture Header
>Date: Thu, 31 Aug 2023 18:00:36 +0200
>
>Dear Sir or Madam,
>
>At the moment Im doing a project over MPEG4 for my university. At the
>moment, i try to find a way to separate the different pictures by I, P and
>B-Pictures. I read somewhere that the information about the type of the
>picture can be found in the picture header. This picture header can probably
>be found somewhere in the MPEG4 Standard 14496.
>
>My problem is, that i dont know exactly, in which part of the standard this
>information could be found, and I cant afford to buy all parts ;-)
>
>I think it has to be part 1 but im not absolutely sure. Perhaps someone can
>give a hint to a "poor student".
>
>regards,
>
>Christoph Spranger
>
>
>_______________________________________________
>NOTE: Please use clear subject lines for your posts. Include [audio, 
>[video], [systems], [general] or another apppropriate identifier to 
>indicate the type of question you have.
>
>Note: Conduct on the mailing list is subject to the Antitrust 
>guidelines found at 
>http://www.mpegif.org/public/documents/vault/mp-out-30042-Antitrust.php
>
>_________________________________________________________________
>All-in-one security and maintenance for your PC.  Get a free 90-day trial!  
>http://www.windowsonecare.com/trial.aspx?sc_cid=msn_hotmail
>
>_______________________________________________
>NOTE: Please use clear subject lines for your posts. Include [audio, 
>[video], [systems], [general] or another apppropriate identifier to 
>indicate the type of question you have.
>
>Note: Conduct on the mailing list is subject to the Antitrust 
>guidelines found at 
>http://www.mpegif.org/public/documents/vault/mp-out-30042-Antitrust.php
-- 
David Singer
Apple Computer/QuickTime
From xxsni  hotmail.com  Sat Sep  2 00:12:50 2006
From: xxsni  hotmail.com (Curry Alex)
Date: Fri Sep  1 12:51:23 2006
Subject: [Mp4-tech]
Message-ID: <BAY19-F20D5E30D51BD9389846D2FBB3C0@phx.gbl>
Dear Sir or Madam,
At the monent I am doing a project about T-DMB standard. I have a file 
which is compliant with T-DMB standard. I have parsed it in Delivery 
Layer(TS) and Synchronization Layer(SL). There is four stream in the 
file,object descriptor stream, scene descriptor stream, audio stream(BSAC), 
visual stream(H.264).
My problem is the bitstream parsed from visual stream which I think is 
AU(access unit) can't be decode by H.264 decoder program.How should I do to 
make bitstream conformed with H.264 standard. What is the structure of 
h.264 AU? 
Due to being a chinese student, forgive my poor english.
Thank you very much in advance for any help you can be.
Alex Curry
_________________________________________________________________
与联机的朋友进行交流，请使用 MSN Messenger:  http://messenger.msn.com/cn  
From Andreas.Schneider  codingtechnologies.com  Fri Sep  1 19:05:29 2006
From: Andreas.Schneider  codingtechnologies.com (Andreas Schneider)
Date: Fri Sep  1 12:51:34 2006
Subject: [Mp4-tech] Mpeg2 aac sbr
In-Reply-To: <1157044698.S.5202.23958.webmail16.rediffmail.com.1157091892.19109@webmail.rediffmail.com>
Message-ID: <OF3800C431.CD70C607-ONC12571DC.00542A1E-C12571DC.005864B6@codingtechnologies.com>
Hi,
the conformance bitstreams for the combination of MPEG-2 AAC with SBR are 
here:
ftp://ftp.iis.fraunhofer.de/mpeg2aac-conformance/compressedAdif/al_sbr_*
Regards,
Andreas
mp4-tech-bounces@lists.mpegif.org wrote on 01.09.2023 08:24:53:
> 
> Hi experts,
>   Currently,iam working on MPEG2 AAC Decoder.Iam going to 
> incorporate the SBR tool in the mpeg2 aac decoder.
> I jus want to know the details abt the FILL Element parsing in the 
> decoder side.Can u give me the link for downloading 
> the mpeg2 aac sbr bitstreams n the net.
> 
> With Regards,
> sakthi
> 
> 
> 
> "Christoph Spranger" wrote
> Dear Sir or Madam,
> 
> At the moment Im doing a project over MPEG4 for my university. At 
> the moment, i try to find a way to separate the different pictures 
> by I, P and B-Pictures. I read somewhere that the information about 
> the type of the picture can be found in the picture header. This 
> picture header can probably be found somewhere in the MPEG4 Standard 
14496.
> 
> 
> My problem is, that i dont know exactly, in which part of the 
> standard this information could be found, and I cant afford to buy 
> all parts ;-)
> 
> I think it has to be part 1 but im not absolutely sure. Perhaps 
> someone can give a hint to a "poor student".
> 
> 
> regards,
> 
> Christoph Spranger
> 
> 
> 
> 
> [image removed] _______________________________________________
> NOTE: Please use clear subject lines for your posts. Include [audio,
> [video], [systems], [general] or another apppropriate identifier to 
> indicate the type of question you have.
> 
> Note: Conduct on the mailing list is subject to the Antitrust 
> guidelines found at http://www.mpegif.org/public/documents/vault/mp-
> out-30042-Antitrust.php
--
Andreas Schneider
Senior Research Engineer
mailto:snd@CodingTechnologies.com
+49 911 92891 -26 (phone)
+49 911 92891 -99 (fax)
Coding Technologies GmbH
Deutschherrnstr. 15-19
D-90429 Nuernberg, Germany
http://www.codingtechnologies.com
From bouvigne  mp3-tech.org  Fri Sep  1 22:59:37 2006
From: bouvigne  mp3-tech.org (Gabriel Bouvigne)
Date: Fri Sep  1 16:51:17 2006
Subject: [Mp4-tech] [Audio]Dynamic range/ downmix signaling
Message-ID: <44F89129.7070009@mp3-tech.org>
In an AAC context, I am wondering what would be the proper way to signal 
dynamic range info (variable through time) and downmix info (from 
multichannel).
I have 3 cases in mind where I think that it should probably be handled 
differently:
*AAC in mpeg-4 container
*AAC over RTP
*AAC in mpeg-2 TS
In AC3, those infos are directly part of the ATSC-A52 standard. Is there 
anything defined about this in mpeg-4 (or perhaps mpeg-7)?
Regards,
-- 
Gabriel Bouvigne
www.mp3-tech.org
personal page: http://gabriel.mp3-tech.org
From nagaraj.attimani  yahoo.co.in  Sat Sep  2 10:05:47 2006
From: nagaraj.attimani  yahoo.co.in (Nagaraj Attimani)
Date: Sat Sep  2 08:34:08 2006
Subject: [Mp4-tech] Freinds , Urgently i need ur help,
	regarding  short video header
Message-ID: <20060902080547.34364.qmail@web8904.mail.in.yahoo.com>
Freinds,
  Please help me,
  i am doing a project where we have support all features of mpeg4
  can u tell me how to parse Mpeg4 short video header decoder  configuration information ?
  and if possible , where i can get how to parse short video,
  since i am facing problem while parsing, even though source format is QCIF , but i am getting CIF format,
---------------------------------
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From ameet.kalagi  ittiam.com  Sat Sep  2 16:46:37 2006
From: ameet.kalagi  ittiam.com (Ameet U. Kalagi)
Date: Sat Sep  2 08:34:17 2006
Subject: [Mp4-tech] [Audio]Dynamic range/ downmix signaling
In-Reply-To: <44F89129.7070009@mp3-tech.org>
Message-ID: <904DEC693BE1AB429622C6F5ABA7E0B8D4A1EC@is01ex02.ittiam.com>
The DRC infoormation can be added to the AAC bitstream as an AAC FILL
ELEMENT. This is defined as a part of the ISO Spec.
ISO_IEC_13818-7;1997_Cor_1;1998(E) 
(INTERNATIONAL STANDARD ISO/IEC 13818-7:1997 TECHNICAL CORRIGENDUM 1 )
Multi-channel to Stereo downmix could be signaled through the
matrix_mixdown_idx in the Program Config Element(PCE) (ISO_IEC_13818-7).
These methods should work independent of the container format.
Regards,
Ameet
-----Original Message-----
From: mp4-tech-bounces@lists.mpegif.org
[mailto:mp4-tech-bounces@lists.mpegif.org] On Behalf Of Gabriel Bouvigne
Sent: Saturday, September 02, 2023 1:30 AM
To: mp4-tech@lists.mpegif.org
Subject: [Mp4-tech] [Audio]Dynamic range/ downmix signaling
In an AAC context, I am wondering what would be the proper way to signal
dynamic range info (variable through time) and downmix info (from 
multichannel).
I have 3 cases in mind where I think that it should probably be handled 
differently:
*AAC in mpeg-4 container
*AAC over RTP
*AAC in mpeg-2 TS
In AC3, those infos are directly part of the ATSC-A52 standard. Is there
anything defined about this in mpeg-4 (or perhaps mpeg-7)?
Regards,
-- 
Gabriel Bouvigne
www.mp3-tech.org
personal page: http://gabriel.mp3-tech.org
_______________________________________________
NOTE: Please use clear subject lines for your posts. Include [audio,
[video], [systems], [general] or another apppropriate identifier to
indicate the type of question you have.
Note: Conduct on the mailing list is subject to the Antitrust guidelines
found at
http://www.mpegif.org/public/documents/vault/mp-out-30042-Antitrust.php
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From pankaj_bajpai_iet  operamail.com  Mon Sep  4 06:28:59 2006
From: pankaj_bajpai_iet  operamail.com (pankaj bajpai)
Date: Mon Sep  4 09:16:10 2006
Subject: [Mp4-tech] Re: Freinds , Urgently i need ur help,
	regarding short video header
Message-ID: <20060904042859.C0F1BCA0A4@ws5-11.us4.outblaze.com>
Dear Nagaraj,
The Short Video header is basically H.263 baseline compliant.
The elementary stream of Mpeg4 short video header is exactly
same with what would be for  H263 stream.
Now, the only difference is the configuration header. Thus,
there are two possible variant in this mode:
1. H263 elementary stream with Configuration headers(VOL, VS).
2. Only H263 elementary stream. This is for exact backward 
   compability with h263.
The availble conformance stream at ISO contains only (2) 
variant. They usually start with "video_plane_with_short_header()"
function(described in standard).
With regards
> From: Nagaraj Attimani <nagaraj.attimani@yahoo.co.in>
> To: mp4-tech@lists.mpegif.org
> Subject: [Mp4-tech] Freinds , Urgently i need ur help, regarding  short video header
> Date: Sat, 2 Sep 2023 09:05:47 +0100 (BST)
> 
> 
> Freinds,
> 
>    Please help me,
>    i am doing a project where we have support all features of mpeg4
>    can u tell me how to parse Mpeg4 short video header decoder  
> configuration information ?
>    and if possible , where i can get how to parse short video,
>    since i am facing problem while parsing, even though source 
> format is QCIF , but i am getting CIF format,
> 
Pankaj Kumar Bajpai
Mulitimedia Engineer
India
-- 
_______________________________________________
Surf the Web in a faster, safer and easier way:
Download Opera 9 at http://www.opera.com
Powered by Outblaze
From nagaraj.attimani  yahoo.co.in  Mon Sep  4 07:38:34 2006
From: nagaraj.attimani  yahoo.co.in (Nagaraj Attimani)
Date: Mon Sep  4 09:22:09 2006
Subject: [Mp4-tech] Re: Freinds , Urgently i need ur help,
	regarding short video header
Message-ID: <20060904053834.86493.qmail@web8914.mail.in.yahoo.com>
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From: Nagaraj Attimani <nagaraj.attimani@yahoo.co.in>
Subject: Re: Freinds , Urgently i need ur help, regarding short video header
Date: Mon, 4 Sep 2023 06:34:11 +0100 (BST)
Size: 5632
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From dthoang  yahoo.com  Mon Sep  4 21:27:13 2006
From: dthoang  yahoo.com (Dzung Hoang)
Date: Mon Sep  4 22:16:07 2006
Subject: [Mp4-tech] about the parsing process of macroblock_layer( )
	inH.264 decoding standart JVT_G050 
In-Reply-To: <20060901073731.75745.qmail@web15106.mail.cnb.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <000001c6d08a$6ac09cb0$6401a8c0@DZUNGLAPTOP>
>From the standard, “mb_qp_delta shall be inferred to be equal to 0 when it
is not present for any macroblock (including P_Skip and B_Skip macroblock
types).” Since no coefficients are transmitted, none needs to be inverse
quantized.
Regards,
- Dzung Hoang
  _____  
From: mp4-tech-bounces@lists.mpegif.org
[mailto:mp4-tech-bounces@lists.mpegif.org] On Behalf Of Yan Zheng
Sent: Friday, September 01, 2023 2:38 AM
To: mp4-tech@lists.mpegif.org
Subject: [Mp4-tech] about the parsing process of macroblock_layer( ) inH.264
decoding standart JVT_G050 
hello,
We find out that when decoding a macroblock of Intra_16x16(we use the
entropy encode/decode of CABAC), the process as following is unimaginable
skipped:
if(CodedBlockPatternLuma>0 || CodedBlockPatternChroma>0 ||
MbPartPredMode(mb_type,0)==Intra_16x16){
mb_qp_delta               se(v)|ae(v)
}
That means the SE of mb_qp_delta is not obtained by decoding the
bitstream.Then how JM  gets the SE value?is this SE value obtained through
other methods? (if so, how the standard be the standard?)
Thank you all.
  _____  
 <http://cn.mail.yahoo.com> 抢注雅虎免费邮箱-3.5G容量，20M附件！ 
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From vishu_dash  yahoo.com  Tue Sep  5 06:03:43 2006
From: vishu_dash  yahoo.com (Deshpande,Vishvanath)
Date: Tue Sep  5 08:40:12 2006
Subject: [Mp4-tech] AAC encoder source code
In-Reply-To: <44F89129.7070009@mp3-tech.org>
Message-ID: <20060905120343.34806.qmail@web60725.mail.yahoo.com>
Hi experts,
Can anybody tell me where do i get AAC/+ encoder free source code?
Thanks in advance,
-Vishvanath.
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From ffreeland  gmail.com  Tue Sep  5 11:55:43 2006
From: ffreeland  gmail.com (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?F=E1bio_Freeland?=)
Date: Tue Sep  5 12:04:10 2006
Subject: [Mp4-tech] AAC encoder source code
In-Reply-To: <20060905120343.34806.qmail@web60725.mail.yahoo.com>
References: <44F89129.7070009@mp3-tech.org>
	<20060905120343.34806.qmail@web60725.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <7bdd726e0609050655u593f1f50qdcb47afed1f2857e@mail.gmail.com>
You  can try the 3gpp codecs in
www.3gpp.org
Regards,
Fabio
On 9/5/06, Deshpande,Vishvanath <vishu_dash@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
>
>
> Hi experts,
>
>
>
> Can anybody tell me where do i get AAC/+ encoder free source code?
>
>
>
> Thanks in advance,
>
> -Vishvanath.
> _______________________________________________
> NOTE: Please use clear subject lines for your posts. Include [audio,
> [video], [systems], [general] or another apppropriate identifier to indicate
> the type of question you have.
>
> Note: Conduct on the mailing list is subject to the Antitrust guidelines
> found at
> http://www.mpegif.org/public/documents/vault/mp-out-30042-Antitrust.php
>
>
From garima.singh  tivr.co.in  Wed Sep  6 01:26:44 2006
From: garima.singh  tivr.co.in (Garima Singh)
Date: Wed Sep  6 06:28:10 2006
Subject: [Mp4-tech] AAC encoder Reference Software Error
In-Reply-To: <7bdd726e0609050655u593f1f50qdcb47afed1f2857e@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <20060906072644.35246.qmail@web211.biz.mail.re2.yahoo.com>
Hi All,
  I am trying to build workspace for Reference Software for Audio Encoder and getting following linker error:
  libtsp.lib(STdec1val.obj) : error LNK2019: unresolved external symbol _errno referenced in function _STdec1val
  libtsp.lib(FLfileSize.obj) : error LNK2019: unresolved external symbol _errno referenced in function _FLfileSize
  libtsp.lib(AFtell.obj) : error LNK2001: unresolved external symbol _errno
  libtsp.lib(UTfree.obj) : error LNK2019: unresolved external symbol _errno referenced in function _UTfree
  libtsp.lib(FLseekable.obj) : error LNK2001: unresolved external symbol _errno
  libtsp.lib(UTsysMsg.obj) : error LNK2019: unresolved external symbol _errno referenced in function _UTsysMsg
  libtsp.lib(UTerror.obj) : error LNK2019: unresolved external symbol _errno referenced in function _UTerror
  ..\bin\debug\mp4auenc.exe : fatal error LNK1120: 1 unresolved externals
  Can anybody tell me what could be the reason?
  I am able to built the decoder workspace using same libtsp.lib.
  Regards,
  Garima
Regards,
Garima Singh 
TIVR Communications - Delivering Efficient Solutions for Mobile Multimedia 
www.tivr.co.in
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From vishu_dash  yahoo.com  Wed Sep  6 04:57:27 2006
From: vishu_dash  yahoo.com (Deshpande,Vishvanath)
Date: Wed Sep  6 07:51:07 2006
Subject: [Mp4-tech] AAC encoder source code
In-Reply-To: <7bdd726e0609050655u593f1f50qdcb47afed1f2857e@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <20060906105727.48533.qmail@web60723.mail.yahoo.com>
Hi,
It would be really great if you could please give me complete url,
Thanks,
-Vishvanath
----- Original Message ----
From: F?bio Freeland <ffreeland@gmail.com>
To: mp4-tech@lists.mpegif.org
Sent: Tuesday, 5 September, 2006 7:25:43 PM
Subject: Re: [Mp4-tech] AAC encoder source code
You  can try the 3gpp codecs in
www.3gpp.org
Regards,
Fabio
On 9/5/06, Deshpande,Vishvanath <vishu_dash@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
>
>
> Hi experts,
>
>
>
> Can anybody tell me where do i get AAC/+ encoder free source code?
>
>
>
> Thanks in advance,
>
> -Vishvanath.
> _______________________________________________
> NOTE: Please use clear subject lines for your posts. Include [audio,
> [video], [systems], [general] or another apppropriate identifier to indicate
> the type of question you have.
>
> Note: Conduct on the mailing list is subject to the Antitrust guidelines
> found at
> http://www.mpegif.org/public/documents/vault/mp-out-30042-Antitrust.php
>
>
_______________________________________________
NOTE: Please use clear subject lines for your posts. Include [audio, [video], [systems], [general] or another apppropriate identifier to indicate the type of question you have.
Note: Conduct on the mailing list is subject to the Antitrust guidelines found at http://www.mpegif.org/public/documents/vault/mp-out-30042-Antitrust.php
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From ffreeland  gmail.com  Wed Sep  6 10:35:21 2006
From: ffreeland  gmail.com (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?F=E1bio_Freeland?=)
Date: Wed Sep  6 09:40:10 2006
Subject: [Mp4-tech] AAC encoder source code
In-Reply-To: <20060906105727.48533.qmail@web60723.mail.yahoo.com>
References: <7bdd726e0609050655u593f1f50qdcb47afed1f2857e@mail.gmail.com>
	<20060906105727.48533.qmail@web60723.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <7bdd726e0609060535l6a7193f9m8a0a6d43b73d1069@mail.gmail.com>
There it is:
This is a fixed-point implemantation
http://www.3gpp.org/ftp/Specs/html-info/26411.htm
Regards,
Fabio
On 9/6/06, Deshpande,Vishvanath <vishu_dash@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
>
> Hi,
> It would be really great if you could please give me complete url,
>
> Thanks,
> -Vishvanath
>
>
> ----- Original Message ----
> From: F?bio Freeland <ffreeland@gmail.com>
> To: mp4-tech@lists.mpegif.org
> Sent: Tuesday, 5 September, 2006 7:25:43 PM
> Subject: Re: [Mp4-tech] AAC encoder source code
>
>
> You  can try the 3gpp codecs in
> www.3gpp.org
> Regards,
> Fabio
>
> On 9/5/06, Deshpande,Vishvanath <vishu_dash@yahoo.com> wrote:
> >
> >
> >
> > Hi experts,
> >
> >
> >
> > Can anybody tell me where do i get AAC/+ encoder free source code?
> >
> >
> >
> > Thanks in advance,
> >
> > -Vishvanath.
> > _______________________________________________
> > NOTE: Please use clear subject lines for your posts. Include [audio,
> > [video], [systems], [general] or another apppropriate identifier to
> indicate
> > the type of question you have.
> >
> > Note: Conduct on the mailing list is subject to the Antitrust guidelines
> > found at
> >
> http://www.mpegif.org/public/documents/vault/mp-out-30042-Antitrust.php
> >
> >
> _______________________________________________
> NOTE: Please use clear subject lines for your posts. Include [audio,
> [video], [systems], [general] or another apppropriate identifier to indicate
> the type of question you have.
>
> Note: Conduct on the mailing list is subject to the Antitrust guidelines
> found at
> http://www.mpegif.org/public/documents/vault/mp-out-30042-Antitrust.php
>
>
From magarwal  NeoMagic.com  Thu Sep  7 17:38:16 2006
From: magarwal  NeoMagic.com (Mohit Agarwal)
Date: Thu Sep  7 09:40:12 2006
Subject: [Mp4-tech]
In-Reply-To: <BAY19-F20D5E30D51BD9389846D2FBB3C0@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <000301c6d26d$ed1ce580$841fa8c0@pcmagarwal>
Dear Alex,
May be there is a error in SPS/PPS of AVC Video Bitstream.
If you can send me the extracted Stream and the Original Transport
Stream,then I might help you.
Mohit
-----Original Message-----
From: mp4-tech-bounces@lists.mpegif.org
[mailto:mp4-tech-bounces@lists.mpegif.org] On Behalf Of Curry Alex
Sent: Friday, September 01, 2023 8:43 PM
To: mp4-tech@lists.mpegif.org
Subject: [Mp4-tech]
Dear Sir or Madam,
At the monent I am doing a project about T-DMB standard. I have a file which
is compliant with T-DMB standard. I have parsed it in Delivery
Layer(TS) and Synchronization Layer(SL). There is four stream in the
file,object descriptor stream, scene descriptor stream, audio stream(BSAC),
visual stream(H.264).
My problem is the bitstream parsed from visual stream which I think is
AU(access unit) can't be decode by H.264 decoder program.How should I do to
make bitstream conformed with H.264 standard. What is the structure of
h.264 AU? 
Due to being a chinese student, forgive my poor english.
Thank you very much in advance for any help you can be.
Alex Curry
_________________________________________________________________
与联机的朋友进行交流，请使用 MSN Messenger:  http://messenger.msn.com/cn  
_______________________________________________
NOTE: Please use clear subject lines for your posts. Include [audio,
[video], [systems], [general] or another apppropriate identifier to indicate
the type of question you have.
Note: Conduct on the mailing list is subject to the Antitrust guidelines
found at
http://www.mpegif.org/public/documents/vault/mp-out-30042-Antitrust.php
From rlandle  gdrs.com  Thu Sep  7 12:13:32 2006
From: rlandle  gdrs.com (Robert J. Landle)
Date: Thu Sep  7 13:04:11 2006
Subject: [Mp4-tech] FMO support in QT 7.1
Message-ID: <A47866F933DF804684068A24BF04A97387441D@gdrs-exchange.gdrs.com>
Does QT 7.1, or any player support FMO ?
I am using the JM 11.0 H.264 encoder to create a .264 file using FMO.
I then used the MPEG4IP mp4creator tool (v1.5.0.1) to create my mp4
file.
This MP4 file does not play in QT 7.1
I used the MPEG4IP h264parser tool on my .264 file and it looks fine.
What's up ?
Thanks in advance.
Bobby
From sugeeth  sarayusoftech.com  Mon Sep 11 15:28:35 2006
From: sugeeth  sarayusoftech.com (Sugeeth)
Date: Mon Sep 11 05:46:07 2006
Subject: [Mp4-tech] Doubt In the H.264 Original source Code
In-Reply-To: <200609071608.k87G7SAQ022508@lists1.magma.ca>
References: <200609071608.k87G7SAQ022508@lists1.magma.ca>
Message-ID: <4505253B.2000906@sarayusoftech.com>
With regard to the original JVT code available as open source in the 
internet. I made it portable and when i try to encode a raw test vector, 
apart from the encoded .264 file and the reconstructed .yuv file, i find 
something called a trace file. Does it serve any significant purpose or 
can it be removed?
From Alexis.Tourapis  dolby.net  Mon Sep 11 06:43:09 2006
From: Alexis.Tourapis  dolby.net (Tourapis, Alexis)
Date: Mon Sep 11 09:16:08 2006
Subject: [Mp4-tech] Doubt In the H.264 Original source Code
Message-ID: <7272EE229DA1AA48B47EBDC47EB0C68B0232FC74@sapphire.dolby.net>
The trace file is created for debugging purposes and to provide you with
the ability to "trace" the bits generated by the encoder or read by the
decoder. You may notice that the generation of these files is by default
disabled and can be enabled by modifying the appropriate #define
declarations which also suggest that they are not "necessary".
Regards
Alexis
-----Original Message-----
From: mp4-tech-bounces@lists.mpegif.org
[mailto:mp4-tech-bounces@lists.mpegif.org] On Behalf Of Sugeeth
Sent: Monday, September 11, 2023 10:59 AM
To: mp4-tech@lists.mpegif.org
Subject: [Mp4-tech] Doubt In the H.264 Original source Code
With regard to the original JVT code available as open source in the
internet. I made it portable and when i try to encode a raw test vector,
apart from the encoded .264 file and the reconstructed .yuv file, i find
something called a trace file. Does it serve any significant purpose or
can it be removed?
_______________________________________________
NOTE: Please use clear subject lines for your posts. Include [audio,
[video], [systems], [general] or another apppropriate identifier to
indicate the type of question you have.
Note: Conduct on the mailing list is subject to the Antitrust guidelines
found at
http://www.mpegif.org/public/documents/vault/mp-out-30042-Antitrust.php
-----------------------------------------
This message (including any attachments) may contain confidential
information intended for a specific individual and purpose.  If you
are not the intended recipient, delete this message.  If you are
not the intended recipient, disclosing, copying, distributing, or
taking any action based on this message is strictly prohibited.
From andyonthenet  gmail.com  Tue Sep 12 17:53:06 2006
From: andyonthenet  gmail.com (Andy)
Date: Tue Sep 12 07:16:09 2006
Subject: [Mp4-tech] where SDTV and VGA Standard Test Sequence
Message-ID: <815a8b5e0609120153k28fd1521v37481af15cd9fb44@mail.gmail.com>
Hi all ,
Experts i wanna use SDTV or VGA standard video sequence(such as Foreman,
News, Car, Stephen......) for my simulation. Can you suggest me website or
ftp where i can download or if have some can you share with me.
I appreciate your help
Andy
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From garima.singh  tivr.co.in  Tue Sep 12 07:22:31 2006
From: garima.singh  tivr.co.in (Garima Singh)
Date: Tue Sep 12 10:51:17 2006
Subject: [Mp4-tech] InitialObjectDescriptor Special case
In-Reply-To: <000301c6d26d$ed1ce580$841fa8c0@pcmagarwal>
Message-ID: <20060912132231.76456.qmail@web212.biz.mail.re2.yahoo.com>
  Hi All,
  I have found one problem while working on a DMB stream having BIFS content. After playing this stream for some time I found that InitialObjectDescriptor() as :
   (Hexa-Decimal) 
  Special case:
  02 81 68 00 4f 01 0C 23 15 04.................
  While in normal case 
  02 58 00 0F 01 0C 23 15 04....................
  In normal working case I am able to map descriptor fields correctly but in special case i am not able to map the descriptor size of 0x81 bytes also I am finding 8 extra bits till i am reaching at ODProfile Level Indication field of InitialObjectDecsriptor.
  What could be the reason for this? Could this be somehow related to BIFS?
  Regards,
  Garima
Regards,
Garima Singh 
TIVR Communications - Delivering Efficient Solutions for Mobile Multimedia 
www.tivr.co.in
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From nagaraj.attimani  yahoo.co.in  Wed Sep 13 07:06:22 2006
From: nagaraj.attimani  yahoo.co.in (Nagaraj Attimani)
Date: Wed Sep 13 05:51:34 2006
Subject: [Mp4-tech] Hi,
	Can u tell me how will be decoder configuration string
	looks like, when it is short video header
In-Reply-To: <200609121608.k8CG7RU7013798@lists1.magma.ca>
Message-ID: <20060913050622.50367.qmail@web8902.mail.in.yahoo.com>
Hi, 
  Can u tell me how will be decoder configuration string looks like, when it is short video header
  for differnt source formats
  like qcif, cif,sqcif etc.
  thanx in adavance
  nagaraj
---------------------------------
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From nitinmpai  gmail.com  Wed Sep 13 18:24:28 2006
From: nitinmpai  gmail.com (Nitin PAI)
Date: Wed Sep 13 09:22:09 2006
Subject: [Mp4-tech] Question Regarding the Deblocker in H.264
Message-ID: <e73559ba0609130454h2747bd9k640ccfc422ee5b68@mail.gmail.com>
Hi,
In h264 baseline profile, i want to know if the cbp is zero does any
deblocking takes place for that entire macroblock?
Thanks,
Nitin
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From garysull  windows.microsoft.com  Wed Sep 13 12:34:02 2006
From: garysull  windows.microsoft.com (Gary Sullivan)
Date: Wed Sep 13 14:40:08 2006
Subject: [Mp4-tech] Question Regarding the Deblocker in H.264
In-Reply-To: <e73559ba0609130454h2747bd9k640ccfc422ee5b68@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <03CB47D9C3F8074498E4653F814D6E8F020D6843@WIN-MSG-20.wingroup.windeploy.ntdev.microsoft.com>
You need to think about two types of edges: Interior edges (edges inside
the macroblock) and exterior edges (edges between macroblocks).
For interior edges, if the motion vectors of neighboring prediction
blocks differ even if the , that can generate blocking artifacts, so
such cases are filtered.
For exterior edges that is true as well, but also the presence of
non-zero coefficients in a neighboring macroblock can cause the edge
between those macroblocks to be filteres.
There might also be some special issues relating to Chroma DC and
Intra_16x16 luma DC, although I think you'll find the spirit of the
design consistent.  There is nothing in the standard called "cbp" so
your question is a little vague.
Best Regards,
Gary Sullivan
________________________________
	From: mp4-tech-bounces@lists.mpegif.org
[mailto:mp4-tech-bounces@lists.mpegif.org] On Behalf Of Nitin PAI
	Sent: Wednesday, September 13, 2023 4:54 AM
	To: mp4-tech@lists.mpegif.org
	Subject: [Mp4-tech] Question Regarding the Deblocker in H.264
	Hi, 
	In h264 baseline profile, i want to know if the cbp is zero does
any deblocking takes place for that entire macroblock?  
	Thanks,
	Nitin 
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From gehariprasath  gmail.com  Thu Sep 14 13:02:19 2006
From: gehariprasath  gmail.com (hari prasath)
Date: Thu Sep 14 06:16:11 2006
Subject: [Mp4-tech] H. 264 Encoder help required
Message-ID: <5730fc040609132332j6eab197fg5f5718cd87d408e4@mail.gmail.com>
Dear Experts,
I am currently working on the motion estimation module of the H.264
standar.I am using the JM 10.2 as the reference.Can anyone tell the flow i
should follow to complete the motion estimation module.I need to know what
are the routines i need to go through in reference software.
Pls help me experts
Thanks in advence
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From andrewk  vbrick.com  Thu Sep 14 10:27:17 2006
From: andrewk  vbrick.com (Andrew Krupiczka)
Date: Thu Sep 14 10:40:19 2006
Subject: [Mp4-tech] H. 264 Encoder help required
Message-ID: <B16BA55653645D439F13B5038E8B17A0047CE1E3@vbxmail.vb.loc>
I need to know what are the routines i need to go through in reference
software.
To learn more, I'd suggest debugging ref. software code.
Best regards,
Andrew
1)       start with encode_one_macroblock () routine and then look for 
a)                              //===== MOTION ESTIMATION FOR 16x16,
16x8, 8x16 BLOCKS =====  
PartitionMotionSearch (mode, block, enc_mb.lambda_mf);
and
*m_cost += BlockMotionSearch     (ref, list, h<<2, v<<2, blocktype,
search_range, lambda_factor);
In BlockMotionSearch() you should find "full pel routines" as following:
    min_mcost = FastIntegerPelBlockMotionSearch(orig_pic, ref, list,
pic_pix_x, pic_pix_y, blocktype,
      pred_mv_x, pred_mv_y, &mv_x, &mv_y, search_range,
      min_mcost, lambda_factor);
and
    min_mcost = simplified_FastIntegerPelBlockMotionSearch (orig_pic,
ref, list, pic_pix_x, pic_pix_y, blocktype,
                                                 pred_mv_x, pred_mv_y,
&mv_x, &mv_y, search_range,
                                                 min_mcost,
lambda_factor);
and
    min_mcost = EPZSPelBlockMotionSearch (orig_pic, ref, list,
list_offset, 
      enc_picture->ref_idx, enc_picture->mv,pic_pix_x, pic_pix_y,
blocktype,
      pred_mv_x, pred_mv_y, &mv_x, &mv_y, search_range, min_mcost,
lambda_factor);
PLUS "qpel routines" like the one 
            min_mcost =  FastSubPelBlockMotionSearch (orig_pic, ref,
list, pic_pix_x, pic_pix_y, blocktype,
            pred_mv_x, pred_mv_y, &mv_x, &mv_y, 9, 9, min_mcost,
lambda_factor, (input->Transform8x8Mode && blocktype <= 4 &&
input->hadamard));
b)                        For Motion Estimation using 8x8 sub-partitions
"the entry points" to PartitionMotionSearch() are:
          //=====  LOOP OVER 8x8 SUB-PARTITIONS  (Motion Estimation &
Mode Decision) =====
submacroblock_mode_decision(enc_mb, &tr8x8, currMB,
cofAC_8x8ts[block],&have_direct, bslice, block, &cost_direct, &cost,
&cost8x8_direct, 
and
          //=====  LOOP OVER 8x8 SUB-PARTITIONS  (Motion Estimation &
Mode Decision) =====
          for (cost_direct=cbp8x8=cbp_blk8x8=cnt_nonz_8x8=0, block=0;
block<4; block++)
          {
            submacroblock_mode_decision(enc_mb, &tr4x4, currMB,
cofAC8x8[block],
              &have_direct, bslice, block, &cost_direct, &cost,
&cost8x8_direct, 0);
-----Original Message-----
From: mp4-tech-bounces@lists.mpegif.org
[mailto:mp4-tech-bounces@lists.mpegif.org] On Behalf Of hari prasath
Sent: Thursday, September 14, 2023 2:32 AM
To: mp4-tech@lists.mpegif.org
Subject: [Mp4-tech] H. 264 Encoder help required
Dear Experts,
I am currently working on the motion estimation module of the H.264
standar.I am using the JM 10.2 as the reference.Can anyone tell the flow
i should follow to complete the motion estimation module.I need to know
what are the routines i need to go through in reference software. 
Pls help me experts
Thanks in advence
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From sandipkrtech  yahoo.com  Mon Sep 18 01:28:10 2006
From: sandipkrtech  yahoo.com (Sandip Ray)
Date: Mon Sep 18 05:04:11 2006
Subject: [Mp4-tech] [video] MPEG 4 and H.264 video encoder comparison
Message-ID: <20060918072810.90680.qmail@web55312.mail.re4.yahoo.com>
Dear All,
  Where can I get comparison of various profiles of MPEG 4 and H.264 encoder in terms of their bitrate and PSNR ? I am looking for comparison data performed with public doman source codes like Xvid, Microsoft source code for MPEG 4 and JM source code for H.264.
  Thanks and Regards,
  Sandip
---------------------------------
Get your own web address for just $1.99/1st yr. We'll help. Yahoo! Small Business.
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From deepak.ameen2k  gmail.com  Mon Sep 18 19:54:47 2006
From: deepak.ameen2k  gmail.com (deepak singh)
Date: Mon Sep 18 10:22:14 2006
Subject: [Mp4-tech] Conferences schedules
Message-ID: <75f190740609180624l1a2eb64bibc1663ef845ce426@mail.gmail.com>
Hello experts,
I am a student doing my post-graduation in Telecomunication and doing
project on H.264 Video Standard in India.I want to know the schdules of
various conference over MPEG, MPEG-4 ,H.264 ,H.26L or video compression in
india so that i can  attend the things.And i am expecting the schedules are
already finallized so depend upon dead line i can work on my project also
that would be helpful for me.
So if u have schdules .please send me or send me the sites/links where i can
check the things.
Thanks in advance.
Regards
Deepak Singh.
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From dyipan  gmail.com  Tue Sep 19 14:05:02 2006
From: dyipan  gmail.com (yipan)
Date: Tue Sep 19 08:22:09 2006
Subject: [Mp4-tech] Some questions concerning the compatibility of MPEG-4
	Decoder
Message-ID: <30c5945a0609182205g355de504y7098113357c2bb41@mail.gmail.com>
Dear Experts,
I have some questions concerning the compatibility of MPEG-4 Decoder, and
anticipate someone can give me a hand on this.
I have a MPEG-4 decoder supporting video streams compatible with ISO/IEC
14496-2 MPEG-4 simple profile, and as I have noticed that there are a varity
of MPEG-4 FOURCCs, such as 'divx', 'DX50', 'XVID', 'mp4s', 'm4s2', 'DIV1',
'BLZ0', 'mp4v', 'UMP4' ect, targeting specific CODEC.
So my question is whether the MPEG-4 simple profile Decoder is compatible
enough to decode all of or part of the MPEG-4 video streams with the FOURCCs
listed above?
My second question is what is difference among these CODECs with different
FourCC? Or are there any documents I can refer to in order to find out the
differences among them?
Best Regards
Yipan
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From gehariprasath  gmail.com  Tue Sep 19 13:55:34 2006
From: gehariprasath  gmail.com (hari prasath)
Date: Tue Sep 19 08:22:16 2006
Subject: [Mp4-tech] Help Required On H.264
Message-ID: <5730fc040609190025t59c7f3fay403b3a7e06858608@mail.gmail.com>
Dear Experts,
I had posted a doubt few days back and i got reply from the experts.I would
like to thank the experts who helped me.
I have a new doubt now,I am using the JM 10.2 Reference Encoder and I am
debudgging the code to understand the motion estimation module of it.I want
to know where exactly in the reference code(JM 10.2) the encoding decision
for the frame is taken...i.e how the encoder decides wheather to code the
current frame as Intra or Inter....on what criteria it takes the
decision.Mytest input is foreman sequence(3 frames) with frame
dimensions of 176x144.
Moreover in the encoder.cfg configuration file it is given that
NumberBFrames =1....what does it mean,Is it that out of three frames in the
input sequence one frame is to be coded as B frame...if so,which frame among
the three is B frame,How the encoder decides upon it?
Thanks to the experts in advance
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From Alexis.Tourapis  dolby.net  Tue Sep 19 09:59:34 2006
From: Alexis.Tourapis  dolby.net (Tourapis, Alexis)
Date: Tue Sep 19 12:10:12 2006
Subject: [Mp4-tech] Help Required On H.264
Message-ID: <7272EE229DA1AA48B47EBDC47EB0C68B023A7AA1@sapphire.dolby.net>
Dear Hari,
I would first suggest that you download JVT-S079. That would provide you
some information on how to configure the reference software.
As for decisions between intra and inter coded pictures (I can see you
are not asking about Macroblocks ;)), if you do not set the parameter
"RDPictureDecision", then such is done in a periodic fashion based on
the IntraPeriod flag. Note that this period is also affected by the
second parameter you mentioned, i.e., NumberBframes. That is, if you set
NumberBFrames to 2, and IntraPeriod to 5, then you will have an intra
frame every (NumberBFrames + 1) * IntraPeriod = (2 + 1)*5 = 15 frames.
Similarly for NumberBFrames = 1 and IntraPeriod = 3 you will have Intra
frames repeated every 6 frames, i.e.,
I0-B1-P2-B3-P4-B5-I6
One thing you have to observe however is that the above represents
timing order but not coding order. Instead coding order is as
I0-P2-B1-P4-B3-I6-B5 to better take advantage of the bipredictive
properties of B slices and improve coding efficiency (note that you do
not have to do so but it is a good idea). I would suggest trying to find
on the internet more information on how prediction on B slices within
AVC (or even B frames in older standards such as MPEG-2) work to
understand why there is an advantage in doing this in general. I would
also suggest though also checking how AVC can also take advantage of
Hierarchical coding structures to further improve performance.
Best regards,
Alexis
  _____  
From: mp4-tech-bounces@lists.mpegif.org
[mailto:mp4-tech-bounces@lists.mpegif.org] On Behalf Of hari prasath
Sent: Tuesday, September 19, 2023 12:26 AM
To: mp4-tech@lists.mpegif.org
Subject: [Mp4-tech] Help Required On H.264
Dear Experts,
I had posted a doubt few days back and i got reply from the experts.I
would like to thank the experts who helped me.
I have a new doubt now,I am using the JM 10.2 Reference Encoder and I am
debudgging the code to understand the motion estimation module of it.I
want to know where exactly in the reference code(JM 10.2) the encoding
decision for the frame is taken...i.e how the encoder decides wheather
to code the current frame as Intra or Inter....on what criteria it takes
the decision.My test input is foreman sequence(3 frames) with frame
dimensions of 176x144.
Moreover in the encoder.cfg configuration file it is given that
NumberBFrames =1....what does it mean,Is it that out of three frames in
the input sequence one frame is to be coded as B frame...if so,which
frame among the three is B frame,How the encoder decides upon it? 
Thanks to the experts in advance
-----------------------------------------
This message (including any attachments) may contain confidential
information intended for a specific individual and purpose.  If you
are not the intended recipient, delete this message.  If you are
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taking any action based on this message is strictly prohibited.
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From bravearun  rediffmail.com  Wed Sep 20 08:32:21 2006
From: bravearun  rediffmail.com (arun menon)
Date: Wed Sep 20 09:04:07 2006
Subject: [Mp4-tech] Does H264 Std support temporal scalability?
Message-ID: <20060920072927.28900.qmail@webmail58.rediffmail.com>
 ?
Hello Experts,
Can you please advice me if H264 supports temporal scalability?
Thanks,
Arun
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From luca.bs  gmx.de  Wed Sep 20 12:43:12 2006
From: luca.bs  gmx.de (Luca)
Date: Wed Sep 20 09:04:12 2006
Subject: [Mp4-tech] [Video] SP slices on H.264
Message-ID: <45110D30.7020504@gmx.de>
Dear Experts,
i would like to ask you something concerning coding and decoding of 
Switching P slices in H.264.
I'm using as reference both:
a) Karczewicz, Kurceren: "The SP and SI-Frames Design for H.264/AVC"
b) Richardson "H.264 and MPEG-4"
General Questions:
1) Why in a) and in the other works on the topic, two different 
quantization parameters (namely PQP and SPQP) are used? Could please 
someone explain me the advantage of using two rather than one?
Specific Questions (Reserved to the one owning both the two references 
and time):
2) The structure of the SP encoder showed in figure 7 in a) has to be 
modified for Secondary SP slices encoding? Since the explanation seems 
to require some modification to the decoder but no further figure are 
available.
3) The primary [in a)] or SP-A [in b)] and secondary [in a)] or SP-AB 
[in b)] encoding/decoding scheme seems to to me be swapped between a) 
and b). It is just my misunderstanding?
Thank you in advance for your constant help.
Greetings,
Luca.
From adamp  ipinfusion.com  Wed Sep 20 17:48:27 2006
From: adamp  ipinfusion.com (Adam Potolsky)
Date: Wed Sep 20 20:28:05 2006
Subject: [Mp4-tech] Encoding information in MP4 file
Message-ID: <006401c6dd0f$47c2e240$6e000a0a@adamgx620>
Good day,
In continuing work on MP4 file, I have found that there is more data that I
need to gather form the MP4 files and I am having difficulty finding this
information. In particular, I am hunting down a definitive way to know the
specific encoding used for the video and audio channel. In the case of an
MPEG4-P2 track, I want to know which Profile was used. (Simple Profile,
Advance Simple Profile, etc.) I have looked at the 'stsd' atom and it looks
like the "compressor" name can be set to 0 for size so this seems an
unreliable source for this data. In the 'ftyp' atom, there appears to be the
data I might be able to use, however, I'm not sure of its reliability in
terms of what I want. 
For example: 
... ftyp3gp6....
3gp63g2aisomavc1
..&.moov...lmvhd
.
.
.....stbl....sts
d............avc
.
..*avcC.B...!..'
B....m....@...Dx
7474  .....(....
Uses H.264 encoding, but the 'ftyp' doesn't state that explicitly.
Is there a way to tell the specific encoding box data?
If so, how, and If not, can anyone recommend another way to find this
information out?
Thank you in advance for you assistance,
Adam Potolsky
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From mp3.aac.mp4  gmail.com  Fri Sep 22 10:07:13 2006
From: mp3.aac.mp4  gmail.com (tech list)
Date: Fri Sep 22 14:46:07 2006
Subject: [Mp4-tech] Encoding information in MP4 file
In-Reply-To: <006401c6dd0f$47c2e240$6e000a0a@adamgx620>
References: <006401c6dd0f$47c2e240$6e000a0a@adamgx620>
Message-ID: <409a09b90609212037i45ec8dccu1263c071c6ac6c87@mail.gmail.com>
As you guessed, ftyp cannot be used. There are encoder specific fields
somewhere in the media header, though I dont remember exactly where.
You could look up the specs.
On 9/21/06, Adam Potolsky <adamp@ipinfusion.com> wrote:
>
>  Good day,
>
>
>
> In continuing work on MP4 file, I have found that there is more data that
> I need to gather form the MP4 files and I am having difficulty finding this
> information. In particular, I am hunting down a definitive way to know the
> specific encoding used for the video and audio channel. In the case of an
> MPEG4-P2 track, I want to know which Profile was used. (Simple Profile,
> Advance Simple Profile, etc?) I have looked at the 'stsd' atom and it looks
> like the "compressor" name can be set to 0 for size so this seems an
> unreliable source for this data. In the 'ftyp' atom, there appears to be the
> data I might be able to use, however, I'm not sure of its reliability in
> terms of what I want.
>
>
>
> For example:
>
>
>
> ... ftyp3gp6....
>
> 3gp63g2aisomavc1
>
> ..&.moov...lmvhd
>
> ?
>
> ?
>
> .....stbl....sts
>
> d............avc
>
> ?
>
> ..*avcC.B...!..'
>
> B....m....@...Dx
>
> 7474  .....(....
>
>
>
> Uses H.264 encoding, but the 'ftyp' doesn't state that explicitly.
>
>
>
> Is there a way to tell the specific encoding box data?
>
> If so, how, and If not, can anyone recommend another way to find this
> information out?
>
>
>
> Thank you in advance for you assistance,
>
> Adam Potolsky
>
> _______________________________________________
> NOTE: Please use clear subject lines for your posts. Include [audio,
> [video], [systems], [general] or another apppropriate identifier to indicate
> the type of question you have.
>
> Note: Conduct on the mailing list is subject to the Antitrust guidelines
> found at
> http://www.mpegif.org/public/documents/vault/mp-out-30042-Antitrust.php
>
>
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From singer  apple.com  Fri Sep 22 14:00:03 2006
From: singer  apple.com (Dave Singer)
Date: Fri Sep 22 16:10:05 2006
Subject: [Mp4-tech] Encoding information in MP4 file
In-Reply-To: <006401c6dd0f$47c2e240$6e000a0a@adamgx620>
References: <006401c6dd0f$47c2e240$6e000a0a@adamgx620>
Message-ID: <p0623092ac139f0d986b6@[17.202.35.52]>
In general, you need to read the spec.  Part 12 
is freely available (from www.iso.ch, 14496-12). 
The stsd box contains both the 'name(s)' of the 
codec, and their initialization.  In the case of 
AVC (H.264), you're looking for also 14496-15, 
which tells you how to find the parameter sets, 
which in turn tell you profile etc.
The ftyp box tells you what specs the file adheres to.
At 16:48  -0700 20/09/06, Adam Potolsky wrote:
>Good day,
>
>In continuing work on MP4 file, I have found 
>that there is more data that I need to gather 
>form the MP4 files and I am having difficulty 
>finding this information. In particular, I am 
>hunting down a definitive way to know the 
>specific encoding used for the video and audio 
>channel. In the case of an MPEG4-P2 track, I 
>want to know which Profile was used. (Simple 
>Profile, Advance Simple Profile, etc?) I have 
>looked at the 'stsd' atom and it looks like the 
>"compressor" name can be set to 0 for size so 
>this seems an unreliable source for this data. 
>In the 'ftyp' atom, there appears to be the data 
>I might be able to use, however, I'm not sure of 
>its reliability in terms of what I want.
>
>For example:
>
>... ftyp3gp6....
>3gp63g2aisomavc1
>..&.moov...lmvhd
>?
>?
>.....stbl....sts
>d............avc
>?
>..*avcC.B...!..'
>B....m....@...Dx
>7474  .....(....
>
>Uses H.264 encoding, but the 'ftyp' doesn't state that explicitly.
>
>Is there a way to tell the specific encoding box data?
>If so, how, and If not, can anyone recommend 
>another way to find this information out?
>
>Thank you in advance for you assistance,
>Adam Potolsky
>
>_______________________________________________
>NOTE: Please use clear subject lines for your 
>posts. Include [audio, [video], [systems], 
>[general] or another apppropriate identifier to 
>indicate the type of question you have.
>
>Note: Conduct on the mailing list is subject to 
>the Antitrust guidelines found at 
>http://www.mpegif.org/public/documents/vault/mp-out-30042-Antitrust.php
-- 
David Singer
Apple Computer/QuickTime
From adamp  ipinfusion.com  Fri Sep 22 13:42:18 2006
From: adamp  ipinfusion.com (Adam Potolsky)
Date: Fri Sep 22 16:34:07 2006
Subject: [Mp4-tech] Follow-up about 'mdat' data and "profile_and_level"
Message-ID: <000b01c6de7f$39857be0$6e000a0a@adamgx620>
Good day,
Although I still hold out hopes of finding a method of discovering the
profile and level of a given MP4, I am trying to dig through the actual
'mdat' to find what profile and level is required to use the media. I've
been trying to piece together information from parts 1, 2, and 12 to figure
out how to decode the data contained in the 'mdat' so I can find the
VisualObjectSequence() and ultimately the profile_and_level_indication and
compare it to Annex G (part 2). 
Here is where I am getting lost: According to the part-12: ".and files
without any box structure may also be referenced and used." (p15) implies
that I can just dive into the 'mdat' and start hunting w/o needing any
information from the box data. When I look at the 'mdat' for a file I have
this is what that section looks like:
0002700: 8700 09d9 8800 09db 4a00 09b6 7a6d 6461  ........J...zmda
0002710: 7420 0020 0000 800d fb60 0000 0000 0000  t . .....`......
0002720: 0000 0000 0000 0000 0000 0000 0000 0000  ................
. 
All 0x00 entries
.
00027f0: 0000 0000 0000 0000 0000 0000 0000 0000  ................
0002800: 0000 1c07 2625 b840 3ff0 11ff e58a 0002  ....&%.@?.......
0002810: 05f0 0382 6240 c69a 606d aba2 824a 65fb  ....b@..`m...Je.
What I expected to see (and I am still trying to learn what's going on in
this part,) is a stream of meaningful objects that set up the interface. The
0x00s are throwing me off, as is the 0x20 followed by the 0x00 right after
the 'mdat'. I am trying to use the spec to break this down, but I am having
some difficulties following it.
If there is anyone that can provide further insight into this I would
greatly appreciate it.
Thank you in advance for your continuing assistance,
Adam Potolsky
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From dyipan  gmail.com  Mon Sep 25 11:47:26 2006
From: dyipan  gmail.com (yipan)
Date: Mon Sep 25 09:28:08 2006
Subject: [Mp4-tech] Some questions concerning the compatibility of MPEG-4
	Decoder
Message-ID: <30c5945a0609241947n170895e0ra7229e64dca18cde@mail.gmail.com>
Dear Experts,
I have some questions concerning the compatibility of MPEG-4 Decoder, and
hope someone can give me a hand.
I have a MPEG-4 decoder supporting video streams compatible with ISO/IEC
14496-2 MPEG-4 simple profile, and as I have noticed that there are a varity
of MPEG-4 FOURCCs, such as 'divx', 'DX50', 'XVID', 'mp4s', 'm4s2', 'DIV1',
'BLZ0', 'mp4v', 'UMP4' ect, targeting specific CODEC.
So my question is whether the MPEG-4 simple profile Decoder is compatible
enough to decode all of or part of the MPEG-4 video streams with the FOURCCs
listed above?
My second question is what is difference among these CODECs with different
FourCC? Or are there any documents I can refer to in order to find out the
differences among them?
Best Regards
Yipan
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From girish  dgbmicro.com  Mon Sep 25 11:00:02 2006
From: girish  dgbmicro.com (Girish Shenoy)
Date: Mon Sep 25 09:28:15 2006
Subject: [Mp4-tech] Follow-up about 'mdat' data and "profile_and_level"
In-Reply-To: <000b01c6de7f$39857be0$6e000a0a@adamgx620>
Message-ID: <PFELKGMFPHONHMKINOPJKEHDCEAA.girish@dgbmicro.com>
Hi Adam,
Have you explored the ES Descriptor in stsd box?
I believe the "Decoder specific info" field contained in the ES Descriptor
(inside the stsd) would be able to pinpoint the exact encoding being used
without too much of a decoding effort.
14496-1 would give you the details of the DecoderSpecificInfo field.
Hope this helps.
Regards,
Girish
-----Original Message-----
From: mp4-tech-bounces@lists.mpegif.org
[mailto:mp4-tech-bounces@lists.mpegif.org]On Behalf Of Adam Potolsky
Sent: Saturday, September 23, 2023 1:12 AM
To: Mp4-Tech Mailing List
Subject: [Mp4-tech] Follow-up about 'mdat' data and "profile_and_level"
Good day,
Although I still hold out hopes of finding a method of discovering the
profile and level of a given MP4, I am trying to dig through the actual
'mdat' to find what profile and level is required to use the media. I've
been trying to piece together information from parts 1, 2, and 12 to figure
out how to decode the data contained in the 'mdat' so I can find the
VisualObjectSequence() and ultimately the profile_and_level_indication and
compare it to Annex G (part 2).
Here is where I am getting lost: According to the part-12: ".and files
without any box structure may also be referenced and used." (p15) implies
that I can just dive into the 'mdat' and start hunting w/o needing any
information from the box data. When I look at the 'mdat' for a file I have
this is what that section looks like:
0002700: 8700 09d9 8800 09db 4a00 09b6 7a6d 6461  ........J...zmda
0002710: 7420 0020 0000 800d fb60 0000 0000 0000  t . .....`......
0002720: 0000 0000 0000 0000 0000 0000 0000 0000  ................
.
All 0x00 entries
.
00027f0: 0000 0000 0000 0000 0000 0000 0000 0000  ................
0002800: 0000 1c07 2625 b840 3ff0 11ff e58a 0002  ....&%.@?.......
0002810: 05f0 0382 6240 c69a 606d aba2 824a 65fb  ....b@..`m...Je.
What I expected to see (and I am still trying to learn what's going on in
this part,) is a stream of meaningful objects that set up the interface. The
0x00s are throwing me off, as is the 0x20 followed by the 0x00 right after
the 'mdat'. I am trying to use the spec to break this down, but I am having
some difficulties following it.
If there is anyone that can provide further insight into this I would
greatly appreciate it.
Thank you in advance for your continuing assistance,
Adam Potolsky
--
This message has been scanned for viruses and
dangerous content by MailScanner, and is
believed to be clean.
-- 
This message has been scanned for viruses and
dangerous content by MailScanner, and is
believed to be clean.
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From magarwal  NeoMagic.com  Mon Sep 25 11:17:44 2006
From: magarwal  NeoMagic.com (Mohit Agarwal)
Date: Mon Sep 25 09:28:19 2006
Subject: [Mp4-tech] Encoding information in MP4 file
In-Reply-To: <006401c6dd0f$47c2e240$6e000a0a@adamgx620>
Message-ID: <000001c6e05d$bfbe7bf0$841fa8c0@pcmagarwal>
I think in the AVCSampleEntryBox you will find the Profile and level of MP4
file containing AVC as Video.
  _____  
From: mp4-tech-bounces@lists.mpegif.org
[mailto:mp4-tech-bounces@lists.mpegif.org] On Behalf Of Adam Potolsky
Sent: Thursday, September 21, 2023 5:18 AM
To: Mp4-Tech Mailing List
Subject: [Mp4-tech] Encoding information in MP4 file
Good day,
In continuing work on MP4 file, I have found that there is more data that I
need to gather form the MP4 files and I am having difficulty finding this
information. In particular, I am hunting down a definitive way to know the
specific encoding used for the video and audio channel. In the case of an
MPEG4-P2 track, I want to know which Profile was used. (Simple Profile,
Advance Simple Profile, etc.) I have looked at the 'stsd' atom and it looks
like the "compressor" name can be set to 0 for size so this seems an
unreliable source for this data. In the 'ftyp' atom, there appears to be the
data I might be able to use, however, I'm not sure of its reliability in
terms of what I want. 
For example: 
... ftyp3gp6....
3gp63g2aisomavc1
..&.moov...lmvhd
.
.
.....stbl....sts
d............avc
.
..*avcC.B...!..'
B....m....@...Dx
7474  .....(....
Uses H.264 encoding, but the 'ftyp' doesn't state that explicitly.
Is there a way to tell the specific encoding box data?
If so, how, and If not, can anyone recommend another way to find this
information out?
Thank you in advance for you assistance,
Adam Potolsky
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From sugeeth  sarayusoftech.com  Mon Sep 25 16:45:07 2006
From: sugeeth  sarayusoftech.com (Sugeeth)
Date: Mon Sep 25 09:28:24 2006
Subject: [Mp4-tech] Practical Issues In H.264
In-Reply-To: <200609231607.k8NG7KLk024442@lists1.magma.ca>
References: <200609231607.k8NG7KLk024442@lists1.magma.ca>
Message-ID: <4517AC2B.3040602@sarayusoftech.com>
The ISO-Reference Code when run for a vector like stefan doesnt show too 
much quality in the reconstructed frame ( And also the h.264 passed thru 
the decoder) when compared to a simple vector like akiyo or claire. 
Stefan is basically complex because, there is a huge amount of movement 
and uncertainity. Well, In real time, a moving camera would also face 
certain complex issues if it even has a h.264 codec in it. So, what 
could be the max. possible psnr in such a complex case considering that 
all the tools of the h.264 standard are kept as best as possible????????
P.S: I observe that in Stefan , since there is a lot of sudden movement 
involved, i presume , that the parameter affecting the vector,  maximum 
would be search range,  however, there is not much of a quality 
difference beyond a search range of 16. i.e a search range of 16 or a 
search range of 128 give me just about the same quality. and other 
parameters like bitrate , intermode  have been allocated sufficently?????
In general, what is an acceptable value for psnr in h.264???? Is it 
vector dependent or is there some value  of psnr that determines the 
quality in h.264???? Other than Psnr, what are the other tools available 
in h264 to measure quality????
thanks in advance,
sugeeth .
From garysull  windows.microsoft.com  Mon Sep 25 12:14:54 2006
From: garysull  windows.microsoft.com (Gary Sullivan)
Date: Mon Sep 25 14:22:05 2006
Subject: [Mp4-tech] Practical Issues In H.264
In-Reply-To: <4517AC2B.3040602@sarayusoftech.com>
Message-ID: <03CB47D9C3F8074498E4653F814D6E8F022D0863@WIN-MSG-20.wingroup.windeploy.ntdev.microsoft.com>
Sugeeth et al,
When considering the demands of a simple input video sequence versus a
more difficult one, you need to consider both the picture quality and
the bit rate.  The more difficult the scene, the more bits will be
needed to achieve a given level of quality.
I would guess that most applications probably operate somewhere in the
range of 34 to 41 dB PSNR.  That covers a significant quality range.
Different applications have different levels of quality that are
considered acceptable.
Different people have different interpretations of the concept of a
motion search range.  In some cases the range refers to a searched area
around the (0,0) vector value.  In other cases it refers to a different
searched area.  The second of these two characterizations is the
relevant one in that reference software, and this is may be why you do
not find larger search ranges to be making a big difference in quality.
You did not say whether you are running the software with the "rate
control" feature enabled or not.  If you are not using rate control,
then the quality of the pictures decoded from the bitstream will
probably be approximately the same (in PSNR terms) regardless of the
input video data characteristics or the motion search range.  What will
vary is the bit rate, not the quality, unless you enable rate control or
vary the value of the quantization parameter.
In regard to your question about what tools are available "in h264" to
measure quality -- this is not a proper question, since the standard is
concerned only with video representation - not quality measurement.
Perhaps you're referring to the software rather than the video coding
spec itself.  In that case I think PSNR is the only quality measure that
is built into the software.
Keep studying.
Best Regards,
Gary Sullivan
+> -----Original Message-----
+> From: mp4-tech-bounces@lists.mpegif.org 
+> [mailto:mp4-tech-bounces@lists.mpegif.org] On Behalf Of Sugeeth
+> Sent: Monday, September 25, 2023 3:15 AM
+> To: mp4-tech@lists.mpegif.org
+> Subject: [Mp4-tech] Practical Issues In H.264
+> 
+> The ISO-Reference Code when run for a vector like stefan 
+> doesnt show too 
+> much quality in the reconstructed frame ( And also the h.264 
+> passed thru 
+> the decoder) when compared to a simple vector like akiyo or claire. 
+> Stefan is basically complex because, there is a huge amount 
+> of movement 
+> and uncertainity. Well, In real time, a moving camera would 
+> also face 
+> certain complex issues if it even has a h.264 codec in it. So, what 
+> could be the max. possible psnr in such a complex case 
+> considering that 
+> all the tools of the h.264 standard are kept as best as 
+> possible????????
+> 
+> 
+> P.S: I observe that in Stefan , since there is a lot of 
+> sudden movement 
+> involved, i presume , that the parameter affecting the 
+> vector,  maximum 
+> would be search range,  however, there is not much of a quality 
+> difference beyond a search range of 16. i.e a search range 
+> of 16 or a 
+> search range of 128 give me just about the same quality. and other 
+> parameters like bitrate , intermode  have been allocated 
+> sufficently?????
+> 
+> In general, what is an acceptable value for psnr in h.264???? Is it 
+> vector dependent or is there some value  of psnr that determines the 
+> quality in h.264???? Other than Psnr, what are the other 
+> tools available 
+> in h264 to measure quality????
+> 
+> thanks in advance,
+> sugeeth .
+> _______________________________________________
+> NOTE: Please use clear subject lines for your posts. Include 
+> [audio, [video], [systems], [general] or another 
+> apppropriate identifier to indicate the type of question you have.
+> 
+> Note: Conduct on the mailing list is subject to the 
+> Antitrust guidelines found at 
+> http://www.mpegif.org/public/documents/vault/mp-out-30042-Ant
+> itrust.php
+> 
From spsatendra  gmail.com  Tue Sep 26 15:41:55 2006
From: spsatendra  gmail.com (Satendra)
Date: Tue Sep 26 10:34:08 2006
Subject: [Mp4-tech] Practical Issues In H.264
In-Reply-To: <03CB47D9C3F8074498E4653F814D6E8F022D0863@WIN-MSG-20.wingroup.windeploy.ntdev.microsoft.com>
References: <4517AC2B.3040602@sarayusoftech.com>
	<03CB47D9C3F8074498E4653F814D6E8F022D0863@WIN-MSG-20.wingroup.windeploy.ntdev.microsoft.com>
Message-ID: <594272320609260211l4a42bb06j53168fe2cba0f3bd@mail.gmail.com>
Hi Gary,
when we say that the quality of encoded bitstream and hence the quality of
the decoded Video sequence, is in some way depends on the search range and
the way we are implementing it, like where it is centred.
I want to know what can be  more criteriae to select the search ranges, I
can count few... please point out if I am wrong,
1) Image size
2) Quality
3) Complexity of target encoder/decoder.
Actually I want to know what are the optimal search ranges, and what are the
most common settings generally found in encoders in this regard. Will the
neighbouring blocks and MBs will have MVs pointed to this search range only?
Thanks
Satendra
On 9/25/06, Gary Sullivan <garysull@windows.microsoft.com> wrote:
>
> Sugeeth et al,
>
> When considering the demands of a simple input video sequence versus a
> more difficult one, you need to consider both the picture quality and
> the bit rate.  The more difficult the scene, the more bits will be
> needed to achieve a given level of quality.
>
> I would guess that most applications probably operate somewhere in the
> range of 34 to 41 dB PSNR.  That covers a significant quality range.
> Different applications have different levels of quality that are
> considered acceptable.
>
> Different people have different interpretations of the concept of a
> motion search range.  In some cases the range refers to a searched area
> around the (0,0) vector value.  In other cases it refers to a different
> searched area.  The second of these two characterizations is the
> relevant one in that reference software, and this is may be why you do
> not find larger search ranges to be making a big difference in quality.
>
> You did not say whether you are running the software with the "rate
> control" feature enabled or not.  If you are not using rate control,
> then the quality of the pictures decoded from the bitstream will
> probably be approximately the same (in PSNR terms) regardless of the
> input video data characteristics or the motion search range.  What will
> vary is the bit rate, not the quality, unless you enable rate control or
> vary the value of the quantization parameter.
>
> In regard to your question about what tools are available "in h264" to
> measure quality -- this is not a proper question, since the standard is
> concerned only with video representation - not quality measurement.
> Perhaps you're referring to the software rather than the video coding
> spec itself.  In that case I think PSNR is the only quality measure that
> is built into the software.
>
> Keep studying.
>
> Best Regards,
>
> Gary Sullivan
>
> +> -----Original Message-----
> +> From: mp4-tech-bounces@lists.mpegif.org
> +> [mailto:mp4-tech-bounces@lists.mpegif.org] On Behalf Of Sugeeth
> +> Sent: Monday, September 25, 2023 3:15 AM
> +> To: mp4-tech@lists.mpegif.org
> +> Subject: [Mp4-tech] Practical Issues In H.264
> +>
> +> The ISO-Reference Code when run for a vector like stefan
> +> doesnt show too
> +> much quality in the reconstructed frame ( And also the h.264
> +> passed thru
> +> the decoder) when compared to a simple vector like akiyo or claire.
> +> Stefan is basically complex because, there is a huge amount
> +> of movement
> +> and uncertainity. Well, In real time, a moving camera would
> +> also face
> +> certain complex issues if it even has a h.264 codec in it. So, what
> +> could be the max. possible psnr in such a complex case
> +> considering that
> +> all the tools of the h.264 standard are kept as best as
> +> possible????????
> +>
> +>
> +> P.S: I observe that in Stefan , since there is a lot of
> +> sudden movement
> +> involved, i presume , that the parameter affecting the
> +> vector,  maximum
> +> would be search range,  however, there is not much of a quality
> +> difference beyond a search range of 16. i.e a search range
> +> of 16 or a
> +> search range of 128 give me just about the same quality. and other
> +> parameters like bitrate , intermode  have been allocated
> +> sufficently?????
> +>
> +> In general, what is an acceptable value for psnr in h.264???? Is it
> +> vector dependent or is there some value  of psnr that determines the
> +> quality in h.264???? Other than Psnr, what are the other
> +> tools available
> +> in h264 to measure quality????
> +>
> +> thanks in advance,
> +> sugeeth .
> +> _______________________________________________
> +> NOTE: Please use clear subject lines for your posts. Include
> +> [audio, [video], [systems], [general] or another
> +> apppropriate identifier to indicate the type of question you have.
> +>
> +> Note: Conduct on the mailing list is subject to the
> +> Antitrust guidelines found at
> +> http://www.mpegif.org/public/documents/vault/mp-out-30042-Ant
> +> itrust.php
> +>
>
> _______________________________________________
> NOTE: Please use clear subject lines for your posts. Include [audio,
> [video], [systems], [general] or another apppropriate identifier to indicate
> the type of question you have.
>
> Note: Conduct on the mailing list is subject to the Antitrust guidelines
> found at
> http://www.mpegif.org/public/documents/vault/mp-out-30042-Antitrust.php
>
-- 
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
"We all agree on the necessity of compromise. We just can't agree on when
it's necessary to compromise."  ------Larry Wall
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
-------------- next part --------------
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From dthoang  yahoo.com  Tue Sep 26 11:48:45 2006
From: dthoang  yahoo.com (Dzung Hoang)
Date: Tue Sep 26 16:16:07 2006
Subject: [Mp4-tech] Practical Issues In H.264
In-Reply-To: <594272320609260211l4a42bb06j53168fe2cba0f3bd@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <002801c6e194$03fd9e40$960ba8c0@DZUNGLAPTOP>
I suggest reading the following research paper from IBM.
http://www.research.ibm.com/journal/rd/434/gonzales.html
Regards,
- Dzung Hoang
________________________________________
From: mp4-tech-bounces@lists.mpegif.org
[mailto:mp4-tech-bounces@lists.mpegif.org] On Behalf Of Satendra
Sent: Tuesday, September 26, 2023 2:12 AM
To: Gary Sullivan
Cc: Sugeeth; mp4-tech@lists.mpegif.org
Subject: Re: [Mp4-tech] Practical Issues In H.264
Hi Gary,
when we say that the quality of encoded bitstream and hence the quality of
the decoded Video sequence, is in some way depends on the search range and
the way we are implementing it, like where it is centred. 
I want to know what can be? more criteriae to select the search ranges, I
can count few... please point out if I am wrong,
1) Image size
2) Quality
3) Complexity of target encoder/decoder.
Actually I want to know what are the optimal search ranges, and what are the
most common settings generally found in encoders in this regard. Will the
neighbouring blocks and MBs will have MVs pointed to this search range only?
Thanks
Satendra
On 9/25/06, Gary Sullivan <garysull@windows.microsoft.com> wrote: 
Sugeeth et al,
When considering the demands of a simple input video sequence versus a 
more difficult one, you need to consider both the picture quality and
the bit rate.??The more difficult the scene, the more bits will be
needed to achieve a given level of quality.
I would guess that most applications probably operate somewhere in the 
range of 34 to 41 dB PSNR.??That covers a significant quality range.
Different applications have different levels of quality that are
considered acceptable.
Different people have different interpretations of the concept of a 
motion search range.??In some cases the range refers to a searched area
around the (0,0) vector value.??In other cases it refers to a different
searched area.??The second of these two characterizations is the
relevant one in that reference software, and this is may be why you do
not find larger search ranges to be making a big difference in quality.
You did not say whether you are running the software with the "rate 
control" feature enabled or not.??If you are not using rate control,
then the quality of the pictures decoded from the bitstream will
probably be approximately the same (in PSNR terms) regardless of the
input video data characteristics or the motion search range.??What will
vary is the bit rate, not the quality, unless you enable rate control or
vary the value of the quantization parameter.
In regard to your question about what tools are available "in h264" to 
measure quality -- this is not a proper question, since the standard is
concerned only with video representation - not quality measurement.
Perhaps you're referring to the software rather than the video coding
spec itself.??In that case I think PSNR is the only quality measure that
is built into the software.
Keep studying.
Best Regards,
Gary Sullivan
+> -----Original Message-----
+> From: mp4-tech-bounces@lists.mpegif.org
+> [mailto:mp4-tech-bounces@lists.mpegif.org] On Behalf Of Sugeeth
+> Sent: Monday, September 25, 2023 3:15 AM 
+> To: mp4-tech@lists.mpegif.org
+> Subject: [Mp4-tech] Practical Issues In H.264
+>
+> The ISO-Reference Code when run for a vector like stefan
+> doesnt show too 
+> much quality in the reconstructed frame ( And also the h.264
+> passed thru
+> the decoder) when compared to a simple vector like akiyo or claire.
+> Stefan is basically complex because, there is a huge amount 
+> of movement
+> and uncertainity. Well, In real time, a moving camera would
+> also face
+> certain complex issues if it even has a h.264 codec in it. So, what
+> could be the max. possible psnr in such a complex case 
+> considering that
+> all the tools of the h.264 standard are kept as best as
+> possible????????
+>
+>
+> P.S: I observe that in Stefan , since there is a lot of
+> sudden movement 
+> involved, i presume , that the parameter affecting the
+> vector,??maximum
+> would be search range,??however, there is not much of a quality
+> difference beyond a search range of 16. i.e a search range 
+> of 16 or a
+> search range of 128 give me just about the same quality. and other
+> parameters like bitrate , intermode??have been allocated
+> sufficently?????
+>
+> In general, what is an acceptable value for psnr in h.264???? Is it
+> vector dependent or is there some value??of psnr that determines the
+> quality in h.264???? Other than Psnr, what are the other
+> tools available
+> in h264 to measure quality???? 
+>
+> thanks in advance,
+> sugeeth .
+> _______________________________________________
+> NOTE: Please use clear subject lines for your posts. Include
+> [audio, [video], [systems], [general] or another 
+> apppropriate identifier to indicate the type of question you have.
+>
+> Note: Conduct on the mailing list is subject to the
+> Antitrust guidelines found at
+> http://www.mpegif.org/public/documents/vault/mp-out-30042-Ant
+> itrust.php
+>
_______________________________________________
NOTE: Please use clear subject lines for your posts. Include [audio,
[video], [systems], [general] or another apppropriate identifier to indicate
the type of question you have. 
Note: Conduct on the mailing list is subject to the Antitrust guidelines
found at
http://www.mpegif.org/public/documents/vault/mp-out-30042-Antitrust.php 
-- 
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
------------------------------------------------------- 
"We all agree on the necessity of compromise. We just can't agree on when
it's necessary to compromise."??------Larry Wall 
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
------------------------------------------------------- 
From singer  apple.com  Tue Sep 26 14:41:40 2006
From: singer  apple.com (Dave Singer)
Date: Tue Sep 26 16:51:08 2006
Subject: [Mp4-tech] Follow-up about 'mdat' data and "profile_and_level"
In-Reply-To: <000b01c6de7f$39857be0$6e000a0a@adamgx620>
References: <000b01c6de7f$39857be0$6e000a0a@adamgx620>
Message-ID: <p0623098bc13f400e2194@[17.202.35.52]>
At 12:42  -0700 22/09/06, Adam Potolsky wrote:
>Good day,
>
>Although I still hold out hopes of finding a 
>method of discovering the profile and level of a 
>given MP4, I am trying to dig through the actual 
>'mdat' to find what profile and level is 
>required to use the media.
then you are wasting your time.  the mdat box is 
a place where bits are dumped in no particular 
order and without any framing.  audio, video, 
everything, all mixed together.  its is 
indecipherable by itself.  give up.
>I've been trying to piece together information 
>from parts 1, 2, and 12 to figure out how to 
>decode the data contained in the 'mdat' so I can 
>find the VisualObjectSequence() and ultimately 
>the profile_and_level_indication and compare it 
>to Annex G (part 2).
Hint, it is not in the mdat at all.
>
>Here is where I am getting lost: According to 
>the part-12: "?and files without any box 
>structure may also be referenced and used." 
>(p15) implies that I can just dive into the 
>'mdat' and start hunting w/o needing any 
>information from the box data.
no, not at all.  The boxes in the movie atom can 
point at media data contained in arbitrarily 
formatted files (including those without any box 
structure).  that doesn't mean that those files 
are comprehensible without the movie atom.
>When I look at the 'mdat' for a file I have this 
>is what that section looks like:
>
>0002700: 8700 09d9 8800 09db 4a00 09b6 7a6d 6461  ........J...zmda
>0002710: 7420 0020 0000 800d fb60 0000 0000 0000  t . .....`......
>0002720: 0000 0000 0000 0000 0000 0000 0000 0000  ................
>?
>All 0x00 entries
>?
>00027f0: 0000 0000 0000 0000 0000 0000 0000 0000  ................
>0002800: 0000 1c07 2625 b840 3ff0 11ff e58a 0002  ....&%.@?.......
>0002810: 05f0 0382 6240 c69a 606d aba2 824a 65fb  ....b@..`m...Je.
>
>What I expected to see (and I am still trying to 
>learn what's going on in this part,) is a stream 
>of meaningful objects that set up the interface.
Dear me.  The codec definitions are in the sample 
entries in the sample tables of each track.  Each 
sample entry has a 4CC (as registered by 
www.mp4ra.org) and in the sample entry are boxes 
that parameterize the codec.  For mpeg-4 part 2, 
this includes an elementary stream descriptor, 
which (eventually) includes a 
decoderspecificinfo, which in turn is defined for 
mpeg-4 part as including the visual headers.  In 
them you find p&l.
>The 0x00s are throwing me off, as is the 0x20 
>followed by the 0x00 right after the 'mdat'. I 
>am trying to use the spec to break this down, 
>but I am having some difficulties following it.
>
>If there is anyone that can provide further 
>insight into this I would greatly appreciate it.
read the movie atom, and understand its structure.  it contains what you want.
>
>Thank you in advance for your continuing assistance,
>Adam Potolsky
>
>_______________________________________________
>NOTE: Please use clear subject lines for your 
>posts. Include [audio, [video], [systems], 
>[general] or another apppropriate identifier to 
>indicate the type of question you have.
>
>Note: Conduct on the mailing list is subject to 
>the Antitrust guidelines found at 
>http://www.mpegif.org/public/documents/vault/mp-out-30042-Antitrust.php
-- 
David Singer
Apple Computer/QuickTime
-------------- next part --------------
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From rlei  ati.com  Tue Sep 26 18:09:14 2006
From: rlei  ati.com (Ryan Lei)
Date: Tue Sep 26 18:16:05 2006
Subject: [Mp4-tech] Follow-up about 'mdat' data and "profile_and_level"
In-Reply-To: <p0623098bc13f400e2194@[17.202.35.52]>
Message-ID: <7E50034CB80EA843AF7E81E6CF832AB06DFAD8@torcaexmb4.atitech.com>
go get a mp4box application from GPAC, you can parse the mp4/3gpp file and get the file structure in a XML file. for mpeg4, VOS/VOL sequence header information is saved as decoderspecificinfo as Dave said. 
The problem is some encoder may not set correct profile and level information in the sequence header, because it is not manditory. 
if you read the MPEG4 spec part 1 and part 14, you can get all detailed information about how the elementary streams are muxed into 3gp file. then read MPEG4 spec part 2 to parse VOS/VOL header.
ryan 
________________________________
From: mp4-tech-bounces@lists.mpegif.org [mailto:mp4-tech-bounces@lists.mpegif.org] On Behalf Of Dave Singer
Sent: Tuesday, September 26, 2023 4:42 PM
To: Adam Potolsky; Mp4-Tech Mailing List
Subject: Re: [Mp4-tech] Follow-up about 'mdat' data and "profile_and_level"
At 12:42  -0700 22/09/06, Adam Potolsky wrote:
	Good day,
	Although I still hold out hopes of finding a method of discovering the profile and level of a given MP4, I am trying to dig through the actual 'mdat' to find what profile and level is required to use the media.
then you are wasting your time.  the mdat box is a place where bits are dumped in no particular order and without any framing.  audio, video, everything, all mixed together.  its is indecipherable by itself.  give up.
	I've been trying to piece together information from parts 1, 2, and 12 to figure out how to decode the data contained in the 'mdat' so I can find the VisualObjectSequence() and ultimately the profile_and_level_indication and compare it to Annex G (part 2).
Hint, it is not in the mdat at all.
	Here is where I am getting lost: According to the part-12: "?and files without any box structure may also be referenced and used." (p15) implies that I can just dive into the 'mdat' and start hunting w/o needing any information from the box data.
no, not at all.  The boxes in the movie atom can point at media data contained in arbitrarily formatted files (including those without any box structure).  that doesn't mean that those files are comprehensible without the movie atom.
	When I look at the 'mdat' for a file I have this is what that section looks like:
	0002700: 8700 09d9 8800 09db 4a00 09b6 7a6d 6461  ........J...zmda
	0002710: 7420 0020 0000 800d fb60 0000 0000 0000  t . .....`......
	0002720: 0000 0000 0000 0000 0000 0000 0000 0000  ................
	?
	All 0x00 entries
	?
	00027f0: 0000 0000 0000 0000 0000 0000 0000 0000  ................
	0002800: 0000 1c07 2625 b840 3ff0 11ff e58a 0002  ....&%.@?.......
	0002810: 05f0 0382 6240 c69a 606d aba2 824a 65fb  ....b@..`m...Je.
	What I expected to see (and I am still trying to learn what's going on in this part,) is a stream of meaningful objects that set up the interface.
Dear me.  The codec definitions are in the sample entries in the sample tables of each track.  Each sample entry has a 4CC (as registered by www.mp4ra.org) and in the sample entry are boxes that parameterize the codec.  For mpeg-4 part 2, this includes an elementary stream descriptor, which (eventually) includes a decoderspecificinfo, which in turn is defined for mpeg-4 part as including the visual headers.  In them you find p&l.
	The 0x00s are throwing me off, as is the 0x20 followed by the 0x00 right after the 'mdat'. I am trying to use the spec to break this down, but I am having some difficulties following it.
	If there is anyone that can provide further insight into this I would greatly appreciate it.
read the movie atom, and understand its structure.  it contains what you want.
	Thank you in advance for your continuing assistance,
	Adam Potolsky
	_______________________________________________
	NOTE: Please use clear subject lines for your posts. Include [audio, [video], [systems], [general] or another apppropriate identifier to indicate the type of question you have.
	Note: Conduct on the mailing list is subject to the Antitrust guidelines found at http://www.mpegif.org/public/documents/vault/mp-out-30042-Antitrust.php
-- 
David Singer
Apple Computer/QuickTime
-------------- next part --------------
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From dattagurubn  yahoo.com  Wed Sep 27 06:26:05 2006
From: dattagurubn  yahoo.com (Dattaguru B.N.)
Date: Wed Sep 27 09:04:08 2006
Subject: [Mp4-tech] [Audio] Info required about IOT
In-Reply-To: <7E50034CB80EA843AF7E81E6CF832AB06DFAD8@torcaexmb4.atitech.com>
Message-ID: <20060927122605.70868.qmail@web34703.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
Dear Experts,
I want to know when will Inter Operability Test (IOT)
of MPEG will be conducted.  Will you please let me
know the place and date for the same.
Thanks in advance,
Datta
__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam?  Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around 
http://mail.yahoo.com 
From ying.s.zhang  intel.com  Thu Sep 28 10:29:03 2006
From: ying.s.zhang  intel.com (Zhang, Ying S)
Date: Thu Sep 28 10:04:08 2006
Subject: [Mp4-tech] [Audio] Info required about IOT
Message-ID: <D470B4E54465E3469E2ABBC5AFAC390F0F8CC2@pdsmsx412.ccr.corp.intel.com>
I would also like to know it.
Can anyone provide the info?
Best Regards,
 Zhang Ying  
iNet: 8-821-6395
Tel:  +86-21-61166395
-----Original Message-----
From: mp4-tech-bounces@lists.mpegif.org
[mailto:mp4-tech-bounces@lists.mpegif.org] On Behalf Of Dattaguru B.N.
Sent: Wednesday, September 27, 2023 8:26 PM
To: Mp4-Tech Mailing List
Subject: [Mp4-tech] [Audio] Info required about IOT
Dear Experts,
I want to know when will Inter Operability Test (IOT)
of MPEG will be conducted.  Will you please let me
know the place and date for the same.
Thanks in advance,
Datta
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From tanrui  huawei.com  Sat Sep 30 17:38:51 2006
From: tanrui  huawei.com (Tan Rui -- Huawei)
Date: Sat Sep 30 18:34:06 2006
Subject: [Mp4-tech] [H.264] A question about the scaling list syntax
Message-ID: <000801c6e46b$db706e50$6497460a@china.huawei.com>
Hi, all experts, when I read the protocol about the seq_scaling_matrix_present_flag, I find some questions as the following:
seq_scaling_matrix_present_flag equal to 1 specifies that the flags seq_scaling_list_present_flag[ i ] for i = 0..7 are
present. seq_scaling_matrix_present_flag equal to 0 specifies that these flags are not present and the sequence-level
scaling list specified by Flat_4x4_16 shall be inferred for i = 0..5 and the sequence-level scaling list specified by
Flat_8x8_16 shall be inferred for i = 6..7. When seq_scaling_matrix_present_flag is not present, it shall be inferred to
be equal to 0.
The scaling lists Flat_4x4_16 and Flat_8x8_16 are specified as follows:
Flat_4x4_16[ i ] = 16, with i = 0..15, ( 7-6)
Flat_8x8_16[ i ] = 16, with i = 0..63. ( 7-7)
[ Question : In the first paragraph, we can get the following understanding: 
    for(i=0; i<16; i++) {
        if seq_scaling_list_present_flag[i] == 1 {
            if(i<6) {
                //According to each seq_scaling_list_present_flag,
                //There will be 16 scaling list elements, i.e.,
                //Flat_4x4_16[i], with i = 0..15.
               //In the end, there will be 6x16=96 Flat_4x4_16 elements for all. Is that true?
            }
            else {
                //There will be 64 scaling list elements, i.e.,
                //Flat_8x8_16[i], with i = 0..63
            }
        }
        else {
            //There will not be any Flat_8x8_16 and Flat_4x4_16 elements.
        }
    }
But I can not find any further usage of the Flat_4x4_16 and Flat_8x8_16. Can you give me some clue?
By the way, I find some syntax comments in the 7.3.2.1.1 just like the following:
scaling_list( scalingList, sizeOfScalingList, useDefaultScalingMatrixFlag ) {
    lastScale = 8
    nextScale = 8
    for( j = 0; j < sizeOfScalingList; j++ ) {
        if( nextScale != 0 ) {
            delta_scale
            nextScale = ( lastScale + delta_scale + 256 ) % 256
            useDefaultScalingMatrixFlag = ( j = = 0 && nextScale = = 0 )
        }
        scalingList[ j ] = ( nextScale = = 0 ) ? lastScale : nextScale
        lastScale = scalingList[ j ]
    }
}
I wonder that the assignment for the useDefaultScalingMatrixFlag variable. It mean that when i==0 and nextScale==0,
the useDefaultScalingMatrixFlag will be 1, doesn't it? When useDefaultScalingMatrixFlag is equal to 1, which scaling
list variable will use the default value? I can not find any assignments in the protocol.
] 
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